Dave_E Posted June 30, 2022 #1 Posted June 30, 2022 Good Evening Everyone, I know most of you and hope you will continue with me on my building journey, this time, the Rattlesnake…American Privateer. After getting my feet wet with the Lady Nelson, I do plan to slow down on this one and really try to do it as perfect as my skills will allow and be as accurate as I can at the same time. I suspect this build will also fall into the “kit bash” category because there are just to many components that I am disappointed to find in the box (for instance, all the blocks are from Amati). I am in good company on this build with javajohn and OldSalt1950 building the same kit and Gregory building the kit in 1:48. The journey begins with an inventory and a wish list for replacement parts and components. Matt D, Theodosius, CDW and 11 others 14 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models
Prowler901 Posted June 30, 2022 #2 Posted June 30, 2022 Excellent! Pulls up a chair... CDW, Mr Whippy, Dave_E and 2 others 5 Quote
Oldsalt1950 Posted June 30, 2022 #3 Posted June 30, 2022 Go over every piece carefully and double check your replacement part list Dave. It will be a long one. Be sure and make templates for the bow and stern blocks and try to keep the knockouts in frames A-C and I-L you will be breaking off the cross pieces otherwise. You already know about the mainframe issue so make that shim piece and reenforce it when you glue it in to obtain the matching length. Also make sure the rabbet is at the depth specified in the plans (trust me on this). Before you start building determine if you are going to put cannons in all the ports it will affect how a lot of the build goes. Read and re-read the instructions and the build logs , depending on how you like to build you will find there are many steps you will take out of sequence. Plan carefully for the removeable bulkhead at frame L . Best of luck on your new build, the adventure begins. Jim CDW, mtaylor, Mr Whippy and 1 other 3 1 Quote Current Build: Fair American - Model Shipways Awaiting Parts - Rattlesnake On the Shelf - English Pinnace 18Th Century Longboat I stand firmly against piracy!
Dave_E Posted June 30, 2022 Author #4 Posted June 30, 2022 Thanks Jim. I have your build on speed dial. 😁 Oldsalt1950, Mr Whippy and CDW 3 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models
Paul Le Wol Posted June 30, 2022 #5 Posted June 30, 2022 Dave, I’m glad to see that you have started your Rattlesnake. I shall take a seat, not right at the back, maybe half way to the back.🙂 Dave_E, CDW, mtaylor and 1 other 4 Quote Regards……..Paul Completed Builds Glad Tidings Model Shipways. - Nordland Boat. Billings Boats . - HM Cutter Cheerful-1806 Syren Model Ship Company.
Dave_E Posted June 30, 2022 Author #6 Posted June 30, 2022 (edited) Good Afternoon All, Must be a thing, I did the same thing on the Lady… build the anchors while you think about how to get started. 😆 First thing I did notice while opening things up is no cradle. The Lady was a bit smaller. Do I need to get a building slip or something for this size ship? Recommendation, discussion? If I were to “bash” the anchors, what’s the recommendation for wood? Edited June 30, 2022 by Dave_E Edwardkenway, BenD, CDW and 5 others 8 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models
Gregory Posted June 30, 2022 #7 Posted June 30, 2022 15 minutes ago, Dave_E said: If I were to “bash” the anchors, what’s the recommendation for wood? The basswood that comes in the kit should work.. There should be a little extra square stock. or use scrap sheet stock from the laser sheets. You might experiment with some dye or stain to get it looking the way you want. Mr Whippy, Dave_E, mtaylor and 2 others 5 Quote “Indecision may or may not be my problem.” ― Jimmy Buffett Current builds: Rattlesnake On Hold: HMS Resolution ( AKA Ferrett ) In the Gallery: Yacht Mary, Gretel, French Cannon
Oldsalt1950 Posted June 30, 2022 #8 Posted June 30, 2022 The kit bass wood will work fine for the cross arms of the anchors. Some form of building board or a good panning vise would come in handy for setting up the bulkheads on the frame. Once the bulkheads are squared up and glued in place you really only need something soft to place the assembled skeleton on. CDW, mtaylor, Dave_E and 2 others 4 1 Quote Current Build: Fair American - Model Shipways Awaiting Parts - Rattlesnake On the Shelf - English Pinnace 18Th Century Longboat I stand firmly against piracy!
David Lester Posted July 1, 2022 #9 Posted July 1, 2022 Hi Dave, I agree with both comments above; a piece of basswood will work just fine for the anchor stocks and I have never used a build board. I glue the bulkheads in one at a time. It's a slow process but works just fine. Then when it's down to planking and sanding, the hull seems to spend as much time on my lap as it does on the bench. I'm looking forward to following your progress. I've built the Mamoli Rattlesnake, which my grandson now has, but I'd like to build it again, this time the MS version. I have a real soft spot for this one. I credit it as the reason I got into building model ships. I've told the story on the forum before, but it was a quite a while ago now. When I was a kid my best friend's dad built model ships and I was mesmerized by them. I've forgotten the names of most of them, but what little kid could forget the name Rattlesnake. My friend still has it. This model would be about 60 years old now. I don't know if it's a kit or from scratch, but the way he handled the stern makes me think this might be a scratch build. Look at the unusual colour he used for the bulwarks. I believe the MS instructions suggest that the bulwarks should be gray. I guess that's what he was going for, but this is almost a pale blue. Also look at the flag. I don't know much (let's be honest - I know nothing) about flags, but I'm pretty sure this can only be a British ensign. My friend's dad was a real history buff and serious anglophile, so he must have opted to display the model after it was captured by the British. From what I've read, I understand that it was first re-named Cormorant by the British and then later changed the name back to Rattlesnake. Sorry, I hope I haven't hijacked your build log too seriously with this digression. David Gregory, Mr Whippy, CiscoH and 6 others 9 Quote Current Build - St. Roch, Billing Boats; HMS Agamemnon, Caldercraft (on hold) Previous Builds - Armed Virginia Sloop, Model Shipways; Constitution, Model Shipways; Rattlesnake, Mamoli; Virginia Privateer, Marine Model Co, restoration; Prince de Neufchatel, Model Shipways; Charles W. Morgan, Model Shipways; Pride of Baltimore II, Model Shipways, Bluenose, Model Shipways (x2); Niagara, Model Shipways; Mayfower, Model Shipways; Shamrock V, Amati; HMS Pegasus, Victory/Amati
Dave_E Posted July 1, 2022 Author #10 Posted July 1, 2022 (edited) Hi Dave, You most certainly did not hijack anything! This is all about the Rattlesnake, the history, the building, the kit, the “bashing”… anything Rattlesnake, and you brought some good stuff to the table! Thank you. Ok, I’ll use some Lego blocks and squares and build one bulkhead at a time and won’t bother with a building slip. I kept all the scrap wood from the Lady and have some walnut that I will use for the anchor stocks. Pretty pumped about this “bashing” thing. Glad to have you looking over my shoulder (especially on a ship you know a lot about)! 👍😀 Edited July 1, 2022 by Dave_E BenD, Mr Whippy, mtaylor and 4 others 7 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models
Dave_E Posted July 2, 2022 Author #11 Posted July 2, 2022 Good Evening All, After unwrapping the anchor parts and seeing the cast stocks… I decided I’d try my hand at a scratch build (which I have never done). So I drew up a plan and built them. I probably went way overboard… I used two pieces of wood glued together, artist tape and real nails. After I was complete and looking at them under the glass, I really couldn’t see the 2 halves or the nails. I suppose I could have used a thicker piece of wood and painted black dots for the nails. Anyway, the anchors are getting painted, a ring made and then will even try to wrap the ring with rope. 😳 PS After dinking with a card model airplane for a week… this was easy. 😁 bruce d, GrandpaPhil, mtaylor and 9 others 12 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models
Oldsalt1950 Posted July 2, 2022 #12 Posted July 2, 2022 Dave, look at the cross member again. Where did you put the hole for the anchor shaft? CDW, Dave_E, Mr Whippy and 1 other 4 Quote Current Build: Fair American - Model Shipways Awaiting Parts - Rattlesnake On the Shelf - English Pinnace 18Th Century Longboat I stand firmly against piracy!
Gregory Posted July 2, 2022 #13 Posted July 2, 2022 Hey Dave, at the risk of raining on your parade: This simplified drawing from Mondfeld shows a basic anchor design for the 18th-19th century. Note the two halves of the stock have a gap when viewed from above. This design seems to be prevalent in multiple sources that I have. Here is a drawing from 1797 found in Lavery's Arming and Fitting of English Ships of War bruce d, GrandpaPhil, CDW and 6 others 9 Quote “Indecision may or may not be my problem.” ― Jimmy Buffett Current builds: Rattlesnake On Hold: HMS Resolution ( AKA Ferrett ) In the Gallery: Yacht Mary, Gretel, French Cannon
Dave_E Posted July 2, 2022 Author #14 Posted July 2, 2022 😖 Further comments to my post #11 need not be published. My bad for looking at the KIT SUPPLIED PARTS. Wonder how many have been built using the cast parts? Looking at anchor pictures I see it. Sucker is going to be quite thick. Parade has been called off. Thanks for catching it. CDW, mtaylor, GrandpaPhil and 5 others 8 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models
Gregory Posted July 2, 2022 #15 Posted July 2, 2022 Many a good model has been built with just the kit parts. No one, me included, didn't know any better. Use the kit parts as a starting place and refine what you can.. Please don't cancel the parade. The rain was just a pop-up thunderstorm.. Mr Whippy, mtaylor, Dave_E and 1 other 4 Quote “Indecision may or may not be my problem.” ― Jimmy Buffett Current builds: Rattlesnake On Hold: HMS Resolution ( AKA Ferrett ) In the Gallery: Yacht Mary, Gretel, French Cannon
Dave_E Posted July 2, 2022 Author #16 Posted July 2, 2022 Thanks Greg, Was telling the Admiral about this and said I could use them and only someone from a group such as this with the knowledge base would have caught it (mine or the kit supplied parts). Lesson ... start with the kit supplied parts, THEN go do some research! Thanks for the pictures. 👍 CDW, Mr Whippy, Quimp Slattery and 4 others 7 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models
Dave_E Posted July 6, 2022 Author #17 Posted July 6, 2022 (edited) Hi All, I think I’ve got them correct this time. I went so far as to build them like they did back when, (bending stock around the shank). I used wire through both halves of the stock (simulating fastening hardware). I see many models with the ring wrapped in rope. Was this a friction thing? Was it on all period anchors? My rings are brass blackened, but it buffs off and it’s not “black” and I think I should wrap them. Amazing how real they look when done correctly… the kit supplied parts were…. 😝. Edited July 19, 2022 by Dave_E Edwardkenway, mtaylor, AJohnson and 19 others 19 3 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models
0gri Posted July 7, 2022 #18 Posted July 7, 2022 Hello Dave,your anchor stocks look great,so much better than the supplied parts.i understand the rings were puddened with tared canvas to stop the hemp rope chaffing,yes your quite right friction. mtaylor, Mr Whippy, CDW and 2 others 5 Quote
Keith Black Posted July 7, 2022 #19 Posted July 7, 2022 Dave, just found your new digs, I've got a chair. mtaylor, Mr Whippy, Dave_E and 2 others 4 1 Quote Current Builds: 1870's Sternwheeler, Lula Wood Hull Screw Frigate USS Tennessee Decorative Carrack Warship Restoration, the Amelia Completed: 1880s Floating Steam Donkey Pile Driver Early Swift 1805 Model Restoration
Dave_E Posted July 7, 2022 Author #20 Posted July 7, 2022 Hey Keith, glad to have you looking over my shoulder Bother! 👍 mtaylor, CDW, Keith Black and 1 other 3 1 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models
KirbysLunchBox Posted July 8, 2022 #21 Posted July 8, 2022 Looking forward to watching you build this!! mtaylor, CDW, Keith Black and 2 others 5 Quote ~Kirby
Dave_E Posted July 8, 2022 Author #22 Posted July 8, 2022 Thanks Kirby, glad your on board. How’s your Lady doing? CDW, Keith Black and Mr Whippy 3 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models
Dave_E Posted July 10, 2022 Author #23 Posted July 10, 2022 Ok… after getting a couple anchors about as scratch built as I can… time to do something else. 😀 Paul Le Wol, JLong, Mr Whippy and 12 others 15 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models
Keith Black Posted July 10, 2022 #24 Posted July 10, 2022 They look great, Dave. Mr Whippy, mtaylor and Dave_E 2 1 Quote Current Builds: 1870's Sternwheeler, Lula Wood Hull Screw Frigate USS Tennessee Decorative Carrack Warship Restoration, the Amelia Completed: 1880s Floating Steam Donkey Pile Driver Early Swift 1805 Model Restoration
Oldsalt1950 Posted July 10, 2022 #25 Posted July 10, 2022 Anchors look great Dave! Dave_E, CDW, Mr Whippy and 1 other 3 1 Quote Current Build: Fair American - Model Shipways Awaiting Parts - Rattlesnake On the Shelf - English Pinnace 18Th Century Longboat I stand firmly against piracy!
Dave_E Posted July 12, 2022 Author #26 Posted July 12, 2022 Here we go. Now that I have the parts separated, it’s time to go review build logs. I recall, Jim, John and Gregory had things to say about the kit at this stage. Edwardkenway, Paul Le Wol, CDW and 9 others 12 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models
KirbysLunchBox Posted July 12, 2022 #27 Posted July 12, 2022 On 7/7/2022 at 9:32 PM, Dave_E said: Thanks Kirby, glad your on board. How’s your Lady doing? I boxed her up for the summer. Remodeling a bathroom and lots of family time and traveling while the kids are on summer break. Hoping to pick things back up this fall. Going to live through others builds for now. 😉 Dave_E, mtaylor, Mr Whippy and 2 others 5 Quote ~Kirby
Dave_E Posted July 12, 2022 Author #28 Posted July 12, 2022 5 minutes ago, KirbysLunchBox said: I boxed her up for the summer. Remodeling a bathroom and lots of family time and traveling while the kids are on summer break. Hoping to pick things back up this fall. Going to live through others builds for now. 😉 Hey man, family first! Good on you Brother, have fun, stay safe! Check in once and awhile and say hi, let us know what’s up. 👍😎 Keith Black, Mr Whippy, CDW and 1 other 4 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models
Gregory Posted July 12, 2022 #29 Posted July 12, 2022 7 hours ago, Dave_E said: Here we go That answers a question I had about the material of the skeleton. It appears to be basswood. It would be a bit of a pain but maybe worth it to double or triple those bulwark extensions before going very far in the build. Particularly the bulkheads for the quarterdeck, I-M.. If you do any reinforcing for the midship bulkheads you have to take into account where some of the gun and oar ports will be. GrandpaPhil, CDW, mtaylor and 5 others 8 Quote “Indecision may or may not be my problem.” ― Jimmy Buffett Current builds: Rattlesnake On Hold: HMS Resolution ( AKA Ferrett ) In the Gallery: Yacht Mary, Gretel, French Cannon
Oldsalt1950 Posted July 12, 2022 #30 Posted July 12, 2022 Be sure and lay the frame on the plans . You will need to make a small shim for the center connection. After that reenforce it Gregory, Dave_E, Keith Black and 3 others 6 Quote Current Build: Fair American - Model Shipways Awaiting Parts - Rattlesnake On the Shelf - English Pinnace 18Th Century Longboat I stand firmly against piracy!
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