SJSoane
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Everything posted by SJSoane
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Hey Gary, I think I see the solution to my problem in your model. The helm port transom when it is cast down has also moved forward. That means I can align with the stern post at its lower level, and still have it sit down on the vertical timbers if it moves back a bit on the sides. I'll try to do a drawing later.... Mark -
I was thinking about a nice Georgian style table and chairs for my Bellona's captain's cabin. Perhaps I can hire you to give me miniature furniture making lessons. Just about beyond comprehension what you can do, Remco. Well done. Best wishes, Mark
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Hi everyone, It is getting more interesting. I have attached a drawing based on the NMM photo of the 1760 Bellona model, highlighting where the transoms appear to be. It looks to me like the one I have labeled helm port transom does sit down on the vertical counter timbers, and then drops down to the side of the stern post. So it definitely is not on top of the post, or there would be no room for the tiller. But Gary is right that it is not aligned with the aft side of the stern post as I had originally drawn it. It appears to line up a little abaft of the rabbet in the stern post, which, if it is 10-12 inches thick, would put it right in the middle of the stern post. It either has a bridle joint, or the two halves tenon into the side of the post. Also note that the heads of the gun ports are a little lower than the helm port transom. More difficult is that when I draw the helm port in this new more forward location on the stern post, the two sides are now too high to sit on the vertical counter timbers. I have got to keep playing with this in section, before everything lines up to look like the photo of the original model... Best wishes, Mar
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Hi Gary, You are right; when I look at the Bellona photo again, the aft face of the helm port transom is forward of the aft face of the stern post. But the aft face seems to intersect at a line just about the same as the rabbet in the stern post, and that would have the transom hitting the center of stern post which could provide a bridle joint between the two. I am having trouble getting the helm port transom beyond the canted center part to intersect the lower counter timbers in this new position, and I will send a drawing later to show this. But for now, do you have the specifications of the vertical counter timbers, in particular the fore and aft width where they sit on the wing transom, and at the lower counter knuckle? I may be working with the wrong dimensions, which would cause my transom in the new correct position not to intersect the vertical timbers. The dimensions I got from Steel don't seem to make things line up. Mark
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Hi everyone, Thanks, druxey, Gary and Ed. It is so helpful to have your expertise and critical eye looking at these reconstructions. This website supports the most remarkable community of learners. This shared detective work is almost as fun as the actual construction... So, here is the latest reconstruction in light of recent insights from all of you. The biggest change is information that there was likely no rabbet into a transom for the upper deck planking. To give the planking some landing, I have shown a "nailer" fayed to the fore side of the lower counter moulding. Some of the planks are going to run right into the fore side of the vertical timbers and vanish down to no thickness at the sternmost end, but it is what it is. I have also shown chocks like the ones Ed shows in his book, because the lower counter planking will need something to land on at the edge of the rudder port. There may be chocks further down, but I can't visualize that yet. And I am showing a rabbet where the helm port transom intersects with the top of the stern post. I don't know how I am going to cut that rabbet in the post at this point, but we'll see. Gary, do you think this is the way they likely intersected? Thanks again for your outstanding help. Best wishes, Mark
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HI Gary, Thanks, this is very helpful. I have sent you a PM with some additional information that show some of the unexpected complexities I am trying to resolve with this drawing. Maybe we can review the contract information with the info I have sent you. Best wishes, Mark
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Thank you, druxey, that makes sense to label the last beam aft the transom. In my photos of the Bellona stern, the next one forward avoiding the rudder head clearly sits down on the counter timbers and is cut with an exposed rectangular end, so I'll go with the curved beam fayed onto the fore face. The more I play detective on these complex constructions, the more impressed I am with the shipwright's art 250 years ago. But this drawing does look eerily like a space ship out of star wars.... Thanks again for your erudite help and good eye for detail. Mark
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New Video on Basic Soldering for Scale Models
SJSoane replied to P_Budzik's topic in Metal Work, Soldering and Metal Fittings
Thank you, very nice and informative. -
Table Saw Blades and other bits and pieces
SJSoane replied to mtaylor's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
What a good idea. I probably could have retired years ago if I had not spent every spare penny on tools... -
Table Saw Blades and other bits and pieces
SJSoane replied to mtaylor's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
Nice find on that site, Mark. -
Hi Mark, It looks like you are applying every lesson you learned from version I regarding precision. I look forward to seeing this version develop! Nice to have a set of fine fittings already made and waiting a new home... Mark
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Remco, you continue to set the standard! Mark
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ROYAL CAROLINE 1749 by Doris - 1:40 - CARD
SJSoane replied to DORIS's topic in - Build logs for subjects built 1501 - 1750
Hi Doris, I am also interested in how you made the flags. What kind of fabric is it (it looks so realistic at scale), and how did you print these in a laser printer? Best wishes, Mark- 881 replies
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Hi Sherry, Can you tell us what paint brand and color you used for that wonderful blue, and how you applied it? I apologize if I missed this somewhere earlier in your log. Mark
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Thanks, Ed, I'll try that.
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Looking at the images of the Bellona stern again, I see that there is a square transom at the upper deck level, which has to be cut to leave room for the rudder head. Looking at the images pointed out to me by druxey, there are a number of 74s with curved beams around the rudder head. So here is another interpretation, with a curved joining piece fayed to the fore side of the two halves of the square transom that I see in the Bellona photos. I am also showing a smaller transom to serve as a landing for the decking just fore of the vertical pieces. I'll try to build it.... Mark
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Thanks, druxey, this is very helpful. I looked up the plans you referenced, with a curved beam forward of the rudder head. I also found ZAZ7907 and ZAZ7908 that show the very broad transom. Gary had shown me something similar. The reason I am attracted to this is that the upper surface of the Bellona's upper deck planking hits the fore side of the vertical timbers right at the same level as the inside of the counter knuckle, leaving no landing whatsoever for them unless there is a fairly wide transom to get some thickness for a planking rabbet. The first drawing below shows how tight this is. The second photo shows tantalizingly shadowy details of what is going on inboard of this construction.... Mark
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Hi Ed, It is looking great. Fun to see construction at the height of the shipbuilding art. I did not have success using a paper cutter for cutting metal. The metal shifted away from the cutting edge. Did you clamp or tape down the sheet of metal while doing this? Mark
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Very nice, Alexandru!
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Gaetan, Spectacular! This certainly shows the dramatic difference between French and English design sensibilities. Mark
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I am working away on the stern construction, and realized that I did not yet understand how the helm port transom and the upper deck transoms fit. Here is a sketch of a possible reconstruction. The helm port drops down to clear the helm, but it also means it runs into the side of the stern post. I had assumed that it would run clear entirely across the stern, but it clearly gets cut in half at the stern post. And the upper deck transom has to accommodate both the hole for the rudder coming through, and also give a landing for the decking. It gets very broad... I'll reflect on this and see if it still makes sense in the cold light of morning. Mark
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You might look into the classic book, Seamanship in the Age of Sail, by John Harland. It gives a comprehensive account of how the sailing ships worked, all of their maneuvers, different sail settings. It is a fascinating read.
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Very interesting project. I look forward to seeing more! Mark
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Thanks, druxey and Gary, This construction is all the more amazing when you see how big these pieces are in relation to my captain. For those looking very closely, you will see that the center timber is temporarily coming down onto the top of the sternpost. It will be cut away for the rudder hole, but I wanted to anchor its lower end while shaping everything. Mark
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Gaetan, Oh my, the close-up and the drawing show that it is even more complex than I first realized! What a masterful job. I am glad to hear that you sometimes make a part four or five times. My reject parts box is overflowing... Mark
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