HMCSS Victoria 1855 by BANYAN - 1:72

[BANYAN]

Thanks Ed, your comments are much valued and appreciated.  Slowly getting there, I am surprised how long it is taking me to finalise the rigging plan  

 

cheers

 

Pat

[Keith Black]

58 minutes ago, BANYAN said:

Slowly getting there, I am surprised how long it is taking me to finalise the rigging plan  

 

 Pat, I'm not surprised at all! It's a whole different kettle of fish working from a know set of rigging plans versus researching to create a set of rigging plans. Old photographs only go so far, old journals and warrants only go so far, it's not exactly discovering the wheel, more like reinventing it. Being able to adapt know plans to what one thinks the rigging plan would have been at that point in Victoria's history is a major milestone. Your reaching that point gives me hope. 

[Beef Wellington]

Love the way all the details are coming together in such a detailed, authentic and harmonious way!

[BANYAN]

Thanks for the encouragement Keith; hopefully something to show on the rigging soon.

 

Thanks for looking in and kind comments Jason, appreciated.

 

cheers

 

Pat

[rwiederrich]

Pat....after agonizing (sic) over the selection of the plan....and now to enjoy your execution....is a thrill.

This is in keeping with your acute attention to detail.  Fantastic job!

Victoria is looking awesome.  Rigging her will be equally so.

 

Rob

 

Edited June 11, 2021 by rwiederrich

[BANYAN]

Thanks for the encouragement Rob, still at a slow pace but hopefully can pick that up soon.

 

cheers

 

Pat

[Kevin]

Many Happy returns

[cog]

happy birhday, mate. Hope you can celebrate with the family, probably a bit cold for the barbie this time of year Have a great day

[BANYAN]

Thanks for the b'day wishes Kevin and Carl, much appreciated.  Officially a pensioner now, will have to take a visit to 'Chelsea'   Unfortunately, while the weather was reasonable, the restrictions still in place prevented more than two visitors at a time, so it was a 'staggered' family occasion spread over the weekend - most enjoyable though.

 

Now back to the shed/workshop.

 

cheers

 

Pat

[BANYAN]

Hi again folks.  I have continued to make some slow progress, and even a start on some of the spars as shown in the following.

 

First up was the inclusion of a flag locker.  This is not shown on the sheer drawing or in any photo/lithograph but will have been essential.  The 'pidgeon holes' were made up from interlocking brass PE (from Scale Warships).  I then framed it with thin (.8mm ) wood.  While the top looks high, please note the bulwarks were only 2' 9" high.  I formed the top as a sort of chart table.  I am also considering making up a similar locker on the other side to stow the patent log (Massey style towed harpoon log), navigation equipment, signal lamps etc.  Not sure about that yet.  I also noted (not visible to naked eye but stands out in photo) I need to clean up the bottom edge of the locker.

 

 

I then added the stern davits I had previously made up.

 

 

I have also now put the bowsprit, with its cap and rigging in place.  there are two small cheek blocks used rather than 'bees' in this era.  The chain gammoning is in place and I have used a copper 'scotsman' to protect the boom from the chain.  Although the Specification called for the bowsprit shrouds (guys) to be fitted to 'iron knees in the knee of the head' I have run these as they appear in the photograph.  I have used iron knees hardly discernible against the black hull, and their location above and abaft the hawsehole conforms with the general practice of the time and provides the necessary spread either side to properly 'guy' the bowsprit.  The Martingale is also in place, along with cap horns for the manropes which will be added later.  The rigging screws are scratch built from 1.2mm brass tubes with a small brass eye soldered into each end.

 

 

cheers

 

Pat

 

Edited July 31, 2021 by BANYAN

[Louie da fly]

Nice work as usual, Pat. Very good result. I was surprised you used brass for the pigeonholes, but on reflection you can probably get more precision that way than with wood.

 

Just out of interest, was there any mention of chain gammoning chafing the bowsprit?

 

Steven

Edited July 31, 2021 by Louie da fly

[rwiederrich]

Pat………  She is beautiful 

[mtaylor]

Just beautiful, clean work, Pat.   

[Tony Hunt]

Lovely work Pat. The little details like the flag locker really bring it to life. It's looking a bit empty though - I assume you're now busy making up a complete set of signal flags?  😀 

[Jim Lad]

Very nice work, Pat.  Are we going to see flags in that locker? 

 

John

[wefalck]

I agree with the others, she is coming along nicely !

 

Deck details, such as flag-locker really make a model coming to life. While the decks of a warship obviously were kept very well in order, they and the bulwarks were certainly not as empty as seen on some models.

 

Metal or plastic sheet is a good choice for small detailed items such as the locker. Wood may be just to 'grainy' for that.

 

Oh yes, and the bowsprit begins to look like the real thing too. I love this transition period, where 'engineering' slowly creeps into the traditional fitting out of ships.

[druxey]

Looking very impressive, Pat!

[BANYAN]

Thanks for all the kind remarks and encouragements guys; much appreciated.

 

Steven, as commented by Eberhard, wood is a little difficult at this dimension - the letterbox panels are only 0.15mm thick.  Wood, no matter how densely grained simply snaps when try to slot and stack them like this - believe me, I tried.

 

Tony and John, you guys are tough taskmasters  I have tried experimenting but yet to identify a way to do this successfully.  Using fabric results in overly large and tattered (frayed edges).  I am thinking a similar style to the hammocks may work in using a pvc rod core and perhaps silkspan or tissue, then paint.

 

I am now being put in a corner (no more prevarication) where I HAVE to make a decision on whether to risk thin wire for the wirerope, or use silver coloured cotton.  My concern is twofold with the wire, firstly it kinks easily and requires some tension on it to keep it looking straight and true.  Secondly, by applying pressure to the wire, I am very concerned some of the very small parts (such as the Rigmaiden lanyard eyes) will not withstand the tension imparted on them. BUT, as I said, I need to make this decision soon as I have only one further task to complete before I can start on the rigging - creating templates for PE to form the parts of the iron hounds and trestletrees.

 

Here is the start of the jibboom - the outer spiderband which is only 2mm ID.  The sharp eyed may note the double lug on the bottom which is formed to accept a long link between them.  I am using a jig a friend of mine suggested/deigned for me.  It is made of aluminium to stop the solder sticking.  I didn't take photos while this one was made (experimenting) but will show the process etc when I do the next one.  Still a bit of cleaning up of the hole in the neck of the jibboom where I drilled the hole for the Royal Stay

 

 

cheers

 

Pat

[Jim Lad]

I think I'd be using appropriately coloured thread for the wire ropes, Pat. A mid grey might be about right.

 

John

[druxey]

I agree that, at your scale, fiber rather than metal for rigging would be far easier to work and look just fine.

[BANYAN]

Thanks John and druxey, appreciate the input; I am leaning more and more towards grey cotton.

 

cheers

 

Pat

[Louie da fly]

You might find a silver-grey, but perhaps wire rope was painted anyway - if not, you should probably choose a thread that looks like weathered wire. But I'm sure you've already thought of that.

 

Steven

[wefalck]

I agree (from experience) that using some thread is easier to handle than wire for rigging. On the other hand, it depends also on the diameter of rigging and the metal chosen.

 

Copper kinks relatively easily, but it easier to turn into loops etc. than harder wires, such as steel or NiCr. On the other hand, when twisted, the wire becomes less prone to kinking. There is also tinned copper-wire that is a bit stiffer than pure copper.

 

I found it not so easy to turn more than two wires into an evenly twisted wire-rope. The tension on each strand has to be equal to prevent buckling of one or more strands. With some practice this problem perhaps could be overcome.

 

The problem with using thread to simulate wire-rope is that the twist is much steeper than that of wire-rope and the individual strands stick out too much. When making your own rope, this could be perhaps overcome by trying to make a multi-strand rope from thin threads ...

[druxey]

The strand issue could be minimized by paint, perhaps, smeared into the conts of the line?

[Keith Black]

8 hours ago, BANYAN said:

I am leaning more and more towards grey cotton.

 

Pat, why cotton instead of polyester? Cotton rots so dang fast. Nice to see you making progress, lovely work as always.

[BANYAN]

Thanks for the further input folks, some considerations to ponder further.

 

Keith - polyester stretches too much.  Long staple cotton is good (doesn't stretch and is strong) and yes, I have to accept it is a little more porous and therefore prone to rot easier.  I am thinking of using 'tatting' cotton (lacework) as it tends to have a longer lay to better simulate wire.

 

From what I have read so far, back then some wires were wormed, oiled then parcelled and painted with white lead paint (but only one author suggests that).  I know from my day in the Navy, we tended to leave wire rope open/uncovered as much as possible but kept them well oiled (boiled linseed) - this allowed us to inspect them a lot easier.  Other authors, such as Underhill, suggests that wirerope used with stays and standing rigging, apart from the eye, the main run was left open, but from about 2-3 feet above the lead block/hole, and then the remainder to where they were secured, were wormed and served (NOT parcelled) and well oiled (linseed oil).

I must admit, when burning the clear protective coating from the control wire I have, leaves a very authentic oiled look - I just wish it didn't require the amount of tension it needs to look/sit right.

 

cheers, and appreciate the suggestions.

 

Pat

 

Edited August 2, 2021 by BANYAN

[Keith Black]

 Pat, is it possible to prestretch the wire to help it lay straight when run? 

[BANYAN]

Hi Keith, thanks for your continued interest and input - it helps keep me honest and ensure i fully examine all possible options.  From the limited experimentation so far, I have found you can pre-stretch it, but it is very difficult to keep it straight while working it.  The real issue I am finding though, is to keep enough tension on it to make it look right, puts toom much strain on the very small (at 1:72) parts I have manufactured, especially the Rigmaiden lanyards.  I will continue to experiment in the hope I can make it work, but I think I am almost resigned to using cotton.

 

cheers

 

Pat

[druxey]

Is that so bad, Pat?

[BANYAN]

Hi druxey, not at all   While wire would be more authentic, I think cotton will serve just as well if I can get the right colour and lay.  I'm just being a little stubborn in trying for additional authenticity.

 

cheers

 

Pat