vossy Posted June 28, 2019 Share #1 Posted June 28, 2019 Hi all, I was just wondering, is Caldrcraft (1:72 version) the go to kit for Victory freaks? Is it the most detailed/accurate on the market? Indeed, is it the largest? Anyone know of any others to rival Caldercraft's version or any planned by other manufacturers in the pipeline? Cheers Chris FrankWouts 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James H Posted June 28, 2019 Share #2 Posted June 28, 2019 The ultimate Victory kit is the 1:64 unreleased Amati kit, designed by Chris Watton. That thing is epic, and I'm trying to convince Amati to get off the fence and actually release it! I'm sure @chris watton could give you more info... hwe, vossy, FrankWouts and 1 other 4 Quote SAY NO TO PIRACY. SUPPORT ORIGINAL IDEAS AND MANUFACTURERS. KEEP IT REAL! On the bench: HMS Harpy - 1796 (production prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 On Hold: HMS Winchelsea Double Capstan - Syren Ship Models - 1:48 Finished US Baltimore Armed Privateer Schooner Grecian 1812 (prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 'Zulu' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 Fifie' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Flirt 1782, Vanguard Models - 1:64. Duchess of Kingston c.1780 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Sphinx 1775, Vanguard Models - 1:64 ERYCINA - Plymouth Ketch-Rigged Trawler 1882, Vanguard Models - 1:64. 'Nisha' - The Brixham 'Mumble-Bee' - Vanguard Models 1:64 'Saucy Jack' fishing boat - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Ranger 'Barking Fish Carrier' - 1864 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Indefatigable - 1794 (production prototype), Vanguard Models - 1:64. Indeterminate: Tender Avos - Master Korabel - 1:72. H.M.S. Victory (production prototype) - Amati - 1:64. HMS Granado 1742 (cross section) - CAFModel - 1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vossy Posted June 28, 2019 Author Share #3 Posted June 28, 2019 8 minutes ago, James H said: The ultimate Victory kit is the 1:64 unreleased Amati kit, designed by Chris Watton. That thing is epic, and I'm trying to convince Amati to get off the fence and actually release it! I'm sure @chris watton could give you more info... Any pics, other info etc? mtaylor and FrankWouts 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris watton Posted June 28, 2019 Share #4 Posted June 28, 2019 Hopefully Amati will release my new design for Victory, which I completed around 4 years ago. The Amati version is fully detailed inside and out. FrankWouts, vossy, Jonny 007 and 12 others 13 2 Quote Vanguard Models on Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffT Posted June 28, 2019 Share #5 Posted June 28, 2019 Been waiting for the amati version. Caldercrafts is a good one though if you can't wait. mtaylor, Elijah, FrankWouts and 1 other 4 Quote Jeff In progress: Medway Longboat 1742 - Syren Ship Model Company -1/2" scale USS Constitution - Model Shipways - Scale 1:76 HMS Granado - CAF Model - 1:48 HMS Sphinx - Vanguard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vossy Posted June 28, 2019 Author Share #6 Posted June 28, 2019 Wow! Thank you for these pics Chris. Any idea if/when a release date? Price etc? How come if you completed the proto type 4 years ago she still isn't released? What would be the overall dimensions of such a beast? Sorry for all the questions. Stunning work! I want one! Cheers Chris mtaylor, Bill Morrison, Elijah and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris watton Posted June 28, 2019 Share #7 Posted June 28, 2019 1 minute ago, vossy said: Wow! Thank you for these pics Chris. Any idea if/when a release date? Price etc? How come if you completed the proto type 4 years ago she still isn't released? What would be the overall dimensions of such a beast? Sorry for all the questions. Stunning work! I want one! Cheers Chris Overall, she is 1.6 metres long. It dominated my large dining table when finished her. There are no dummy barrels on this one, all fully detailed carriages with full length cannon. There should be a thread with a lot more pics somewhere on here. I do not work for Amati any longer, so cannot tell you when it will be released. What I do know is that I did complete everything, designs, instructions, manual, plans. I think Amati are worried the kit will cost too much, but I suspect it would still sell. But, as I said, I no longer work there, it may be an idea to email them, asking for it to be released - it would be nice, as that development was two full years of my life. Even took a trip to Portsmouth to take my own research pics. vossy, Bill Morrison, FrankWouts and 3 others 6 Quote Vanguard Models on Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vossy Posted June 28, 2019 Author Share #8 Posted June 28, 2019 I will definitely contact them. Given you designed her, drew the scale plans etc. do you still retain any ownership to the model? Could you not sell her as part of your current venture? As for cost; Amati are kidding themselves if they think junkies like us wont spend the big bucks on things of rare quality and beauty such as this! Sure, its not a kit that will fly out the door in the hundreds, but I bet more than a few on here alone would buy it. Any chance you could maybe post a few more pics of your design in stages/completion? Fully understand if for copyright reasons etc. you cannot. Thanks for your work. Cheers Chris FrankWouts, mtaylor, Elijah and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James H Posted June 28, 2019 Share #9 Posted June 28, 2019 Tried do do a little trickery on two of those photos.... Elijah, JeffT, Bill Morrison and 3 others 6 Quote SAY NO TO PIRACY. SUPPORT ORIGINAL IDEAS AND MANUFACTURERS. KEEP IT REAL! On the bench: HMS Harpy - 1796 (production prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 On Hold: HMS Winchelsea Double Capstan - Syren Ship Models - 1:48 Finished US Baltimore Armed Privateer Schooner Grecian 1812 (prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 'Zulu' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 Fifie' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Flirt 1782, Vanguard Models - 1:64. Duchess of Kingston c.1780 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Sphinx 1775, Vanguard Models - 1:64 ERYCINA - Plymouth Ketch-Rigged Trawler 1882, Vanguard Models - 1:64. 'Nisha' - The Brixham 'Mumble-Bee' - Vanguard Models 1:64 'Saucy Jack' fishing boat - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Ranger 'Barking Fish Carrier' - 1864 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Indefatigable - 1794 (production prototype), Vanguard Models - 1:64. Indeterminate: Tender Avos - Master Korabel - 1:72. H.M.S. Victory (production prototype) - Amati - 1:64. HMS Granado 1742 (cross section) - CAFModel - 1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris watton Posted June 28, 2019 Share #10 Posted June 28, 2019 (edited) 24 minutes ago, vossy said: I will definitely contact them. Given you designed her, drew the scale plans etc. do you still retain any ownership to the model? Could you not sell her as part of your current venture? As for cost; Amati are kidding themselves if they think junkies like us wont spend the big bucks on things of rare quality and beauty such as this! Sure, its not a kit that will fly out the door in the hundreds, but I bet more than a few on here alone would buy it. Any chance you could maybe post a few more pics of your design in stages/completion? Fully understand if for copyright reasons etc. you cannot. Thanks for your work. Cheers Chris Amati own the rights, they paid me to design it for them, so it is 100% Amati's kit. I have got more pics, also, if you do a search on MSW, there is a long thread that is full of development updates with lots of Victory pictures I took. I have added the one with my step daughter (she'll be pleased I dug that one up), so you can get an idea of the size. Most other pics are in the large format (for the building manual), so too big to post. ETA - I have added a couple of (very bad) pics I took when I delivered the Victory model to Amati, she is sitting next to Vanguard. Edited June 28, 2019 by chris watton Gord-Canada, VonHoldinghausen, paulsutcliffe and 10 others 13 Quote Vanguard Models on Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesT1 Posted June 28, 2019 Share #11 Posted June 28, 2019 Two beautiful ships Chris,,, is the smaller one the Agamemnon Many thanks Jim Elijah, FrankWouts and mtaylor 3 Quote Jim T Current build: HMS Agamemnon - Caldercraft - 1:64 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James H Posted June 29, 2019 Share #12 Posted June 29, 2019 8 hours ago, JamesT1 said: Two beautiful ships Chris,,, is the smaller one the Agamemnon Many thanks Jim Vanguard. Agamemnon wasn't an Amati kit. Elijah, Bill Morrison, mtaylor and 1 other 4 Quote SAY NO TO PIRACY. SUPPORT ORIGINAL IDEAS AND MANUFACTURERS. KEEP IT REAL! On the bench: HMS Harpy - 1796 (production prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 On Hold: HMS Winchelsea Double Capstan - Syren Ship Models - 1:48 Finished US Baltimore Armed Privateer Schooner Grecian 1812 (prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 'Zulu' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 Fifie' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Flirt 1782, Vanguard Models - 1:64. Duchess of Kingston c.1780 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Sphinx 1775, Vanguard Models - 1:64 ERYCINA - Plymouth Ketch-Rigged Trawler 1882, Vanguard Models - 1:64. 'Nisha' - The Brixham 'Mumble-Bee' - Vanguard Models 1:64 'Saucy Jack' fishing boat - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Ranger 'Barking Fish Carrier' - 1864 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Indefatigable - 1794 (production prototype), Vanguard Models - 1:64. Indeterminate: Tender Avos - Master Korabel - 1:72. H.M.S. Victory (production prototype) - Amati - 1:64. HMS Granado 1742 (cross section) - CAFModel - 1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris watton Posted June 29, 2019 Share #13 Posted June 29, 2019 Don't quote me, but I think there may be some real movement regarding Amati releasing the 64th scale Victory. I would be so happy to see this released - I no longer work there, but this was two years work for me, and would be fantastic to see it available to buy. gieb8688, Sea Hoss, FrankWouts and 7 others 10 Quote Vanguard Models on Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vossy Posted June 29, 2019 Author Share #14 Posted June 29, 2019 5 hours ago, chris watton said: Don't quote me, but I think there may be some real movement regarding Amati releasing the 64th scale Victory. I would be so happy to see this released - I no longer work there, but this was two years work for me, and would be fantastic to see it available to buy. Just received an email from Amati regarding your Victory. Seems we may all have good reason to start getting excited! Cheers Chris FrankWouts, chris watton, mtaylor and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James H Posted June 29, 2019 Share #15 Posted June 29, 2019 1 hour ago, vossy said: Just received an email from Amati regarding your Victory. Seems we may all have good reason to start getting excited! Cheers Chris Ain't that the truth!! 🍺 Ponto, Elijah, chris watton and 2 others 5 Quote SAY NO TO PIRACY. SUPPORT ORIGINAL IDEAS AND MANUFACTURERS. KEEP IT REAL! On the bench: HMS Harpy - 1796 (production prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 On Hold: HMS Winchelsea Double Capstan - Syren Ship Models - 1:48 Finished US Baltimore Armed Privateer Schooner Grecian 1812 (prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 'Zulu' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 Fifie' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Flirt 1782, Vanguard Models - 1:64. Duchess of Kingston c.1780 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Sphinx 1775, Vanguard Models - 1:64 ERYCINA - Plymouth Ketch-Rigged Trawler 1882, Vanguard Models - 1:64. 'Nisha' - The Brixham 'Mumble-Bee' - Vanguard Models 1:64 'Saucy Jack' fishing boat - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Ranger 'Barking Fish Carrier' - 1864 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Indefatigable - 1794 (production prototype), Vanguard Models - 1:64. Indeterminate: Tender Avos - Master Korabel - 1:72. H.M.S. Victory (production prototype) - Amati - 1:64. HMS Granado 1742 (cross section) - CAFModel - 1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vossy Posted June 29, 2019 Author Share #16 Posted June 29, 2019 Looking at splitting the kit to make it more cost effective over a period of time for modellers. Good idea I reckon. Will let Emilio from Amati explain more. He said he will make a post here to explain further. Cheers Chris Landrotten Highlander, Elijah and mtaylor 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landrotten Highlander Posted June 29, 2019 Share #17 Posted June 29, 2019 I started with kits but went over to the dark side (scratch building), but for this one - the HMS Victory at 1:64 - I will reconsider, even though it is the 'wrong' scale, as my builds are 1:48 or 1:32 Elijah and mtaylor 2 Quote Heghlu'meH QaQ jajvam Slainte gu mhath L.H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ponto Posted June 29, 2019 Share #18 Posted June 29, 2019 I'm guessing plenty of projects will be sidelined once this magnificent kit is released. As long as the developers stay true to the prototype and the retail numbers meet with approval, I foresee a shortage of stock at the distributors level because of high demand . Not many builders will be able to resist jumping on this bandwagon..... me included!!! mtaylor, JamesT1 and Elijah 3 Quote Built & De-Commissioned: HMS Endeavour (Corel), HMS Unicorn (Corel), Abandoned: HMS Bounty (AL) Completed : Wappen Von Hamburg (Corel), Le Renommee (Euromodel)... on hold Current WIP: Berlin by Corel On Shelf: HMS Bounty (Billings), Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris watton Posted June 29, 2019 Share #19 Posted June 29, 2019 Here is a drawing of the stern, with all the PE parts in place. In the kit, there is an option for how you want to show the windows. You can have them open, part open or closed. If some are open, you can peer through them and just make out the deck detail along the hull. The balustrades in between the window tiers have the exact same number as the real thing. I taken a lot of pictures of the stern when at Portsmouth, and imported the best into my CAD program, and then traced the outlines of the decoration so it should be all a near exact match for the real thing. I know that one version of Victory has these parts all out of proportion, I didn't want anything to stand out that may be wrong.. Also, on my visit, I noted that the poop screen bulkheads have hinges at the top, presumably to fold the bulkheads up and stowed under the poop deck when cleared for action. I threw out the old version of the bulkheads I had already made up and replaced them with the new ones with better detail. JeffT, Ryland Craze, ccoyle and 4 others 7 Quote Vanguard Models on Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vossy Posted June 29, 2019 Author Share #20 Posted June 29, 2019 You're just teasing now! lol Cheers Chris FrankWouts, mtaylor and Elijah 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris watton Posted June 29, 2019 Share #21 Posted June 29, 2019 (edited) Here are the three deck levels, but the assembly starts at the orlop level. I know some baulk at the thought of using MDF (I did to begin with, if I am honest), but it is the perfect non-varying thickness of quality MDF that allowed me to think of such designs. Plywood thickness is never constant, if I used that, this assembly would have been a disaster, some hulls may end up being a few mm higher than they should, and some a lot lower, as ply thickness can vary from 5.6-6.4 for 6mm thickness. The structural integrity of this hull is very strong, plus all gun ports already worked into the hull structure, so no guessing or marking out needed. The way this is designed is that you can build up to one deck level and detail it very easily without obstruction, and when complete, build up the next level and do the same, like a layer cake. ETA - Even all of the gun port sills and gun port lids were pre-cut to fit each individual gun port. Edited June 29, 2019 by chris watton marktiedens, Morgan, BenD and 11 others 14 Quote Vanguard Models on Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James H Posted June 29, 2019 Share #22 Posted June 29, 2019 Ho-lee mo-lee! Elijah, mtaylor, JeffT and 2 others 5 Quote SAY NO TO PIRACY. SUPPORT ORIGINAL IDEAS AND MANUFACTURERS. KEEP IT REAL! On the bench: HMS Harpy - 1796 (production prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 On Hold: HMS Winchelsea Double Capstan - Syren Ship Models - 1:48 Finished US Baltimore Armed Privateer Schooner Grecian 1812 (prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 'Zulu' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 Fifie' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Flirt 1782, Vanguard Models - 1:64. Duchess of Kingston c.1780 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Sphinx 1775, Vanguard Models - 1:64 ERYCINA - Plymouth Ketch-Rigged Trawler 1882, Vanguard Models - 1:64. 'Nisha' - The Brixham 'Mumble-Bee' - Vanguard Models 1:64 'Saucy Jack' fishing boat - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Ranger 'Barking Fish Carrier' - 1864 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Indefatigable - 1794 (production prototype), Vanguard Models - 1:64. Indeterminate: Tender Avos - Master Korabel - 1:72. H.M.S. Victory (production prototype) - Amati - 1:64. HMS Granado 1742 (cross section) - CAFModel - 1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James H Posted June 29, 2019 Share #23 Posted June 29, 2019 2 minutes ago, Y.T. said: So may I ask how much this kit costs? It's not yet released. Amati haven't actually agreed to release yet, let alone set a price point. mtaylor and Elijah 2 Quote SAY NO TO PIRACY. SUPPORT ORIGINAL IDEAS AND MANUFACTURERS. KEEP IT REAL! On the bench: HMS Harpy - 1796 (production prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 On Hold: HMS Winchelsea Double Capstan - Syren Ship Models - 1:48 Finished US Baltimore Armed Privateer Schooner Grecian 1812 (prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 'Zulu' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 Fifie' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Flirt 1782, Vanguard Models - 1:64. Duchess of Kingston c.1780 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Sphinx 1775, Vanguard Models - 1:64 ERYCINA - Plymouth Ketch-Rigged Trawler 1882, Vanguard Models - 1:64. 'Nisha' - The Brixham 'Mumble-Bee' - Vanguard Models 1:64 'Saucy Jack' fishing boat - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Ranger 'Barking Fish Carrier' - 1864 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Indefatigable - 1794 (production prototype), Vanguard Models - 1:64. Indeterminate: Tender Avos - Master Korabel - 1:72. H.M.S. Victory (production prototype) - Amati - 1:64. HMS Granado 1742 (cross section) - CAFModel - 1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James H Posted June 29, 2019 Share #24 Posted June 29, 2019 We could guess based on other releases, but it could be way off the mark. I would reckon at least around £1000....as a total guess. Elijah and mtaylor 2 Quote SAY NO TO PIRACY. SUPPORT ORIGINAL IDEAS AND MANUFACTURERS. KEEP IT REAL! On the bench: HMS Harpy - 1796 (production prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 On Hold: HMS Winchelsea Double Capstan - Syren Ship Models - 1:48 Finished US Baltimore Armed Privateer Schooner Grecian 1812 (prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 'Zulu' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 Fifie' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Flirt 1782, Vanguard Models - 1:64. Duchess of Kingston c.1780 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Sphinx 1775, Vanguard Models - 1:64 ERYCINA - Plymouth Ketch-Rigged Trawler 1882, Vanguard Models - 1:64. 'Nisha' - The Brixham 'Mumble-Bee' - Vanguard Models 1:64 'Saucy Jack' fishing boat - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Ranger 'Barking Fish Carrier' - 1864 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Indefatigable - 1794 (production prototype), Vanguard Models - 1:64. Indeterminate: Tender Avos - Master Korabel - 1:72. H.M.S. Victory (production prototype) - Amati - 1:64. HMS Granado 1742 (cross section) - CAFModel - 1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris watton Posted June 29, 2019 Share #25 Posted June 29, 2019 OK, just sorted out a few more pics, mostly from the manual (There are 917 construction pics and well over the same amount for line drawings) The first is the orlop, when I started the build, I was still waiting for the many sheets of PE to be delivered, so couldn't add the gratings (all PE so I could design to exact size). Some pics show the model a little rough around the edges, this is because it is before any final model touch ups.. Cabbie, JpR62, ccoyle and 9 others 12 Quote Vanguard Models on Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cabbie Posted June 29, 2019 Share #26 Posted June 29, 2019 "A bit rough around the edges" Listen to the man will you. Get me a strong magnifying glass I might see something a bit rough, maybe! Yes, and thanks Chris now I need a new keyboard, totally covered in drool. If only time and money didn't matter, better buy another lotto ticket. Cheers Chris mtaylor and Elijah 2 Quote HM Cutter Mermaid 1817 HMB Endeavour 1768 by Cabbie - Artesania Latina - 1:60 - Kit Fiddle Every action has a consequence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jib Posted July 4, 2019 Share #27 Posted July 4, 2019 So after many years thinking about building a victory kit, I set out to discover which is the definitive one, I come across a posting regarding one in development that is anticipated to be the new premier, after reading more into it decide, yep that's the one for me, and then find myself here only to discover the designer, is a fellow forester! How cool is that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris watton Posted July 5, 2019 Share #28 Posted July 5, 2019 On 7/4/2019 at 3:12 AM, Jib said: So after many years thinking about building a victory kit, I set out to discover which is the definitive one, I come across a posting regarding one in development that is anticipated to be the new premier, after reading more into it decide, yep that's the one for me, and then find myself here only to discover the designer, is a fellow forester! How cool is that. You must be close, then, I am in Cinderford! mtaylor and Elijah 2 Quote Vanguard Models on Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vossy Posted July 5, 2019 Author Share #29 Posted July 5, 2019 Hi Chris, did you design the Caldercraft 1:72 Victory? If so, how does it compare in accuracy/detail to your much anticipated Amati 1:64 version? Cheers Chris Elijah, mtaylor and Canute 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris watton Posted July 5, 2019 Share #30 Posted July 5, 2019 1 minute ago, vossy said: Hi Chris, did you design the Caldercraft 1:72 Victory? If so, how does it compare in accuracy/detail to your much anticipated Amati 1:64 version? Cheers Chris I designed the majority before I handed in my notice in late 2001. I had nothing to do with the stern carvings or PE. I left before completing it. I cannot comment on the differences, as there are quite a few years to separate the two, and it would not be cricket to talk about accuracy/detail between the two. vossy, Canute, mtaylor and 1 other 4 Quote Vanguard Models on Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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