HMS Pegasus by flyer - FINISHED - Victory Models

[Blue Ensign]

Nice work on the rigging Peter, and the cutter is looking pretty neat. I think some sort of chocking is necessary, but I've not been able to identify the how or what from contemporary models as yet.

 

Cheers,

 

B.E.

[md1400cs]

Peter,

 

That cutter will look great. Nice update !

 

Michael

[flyer]

Hi Mobbsie

 

Thank you.

 As I will stow the smaller cutter inside the blue one, there will be no further detailing of this boat. But on the smaller cutter I will try some detailing with oars etc.

 

 

Hi Martin

 

Thanks. Fortunately there are some etched brass oars included in the caldercraft kits and they will do for my level of detailing.

 

 

Hi Michael

 

Thank you. I think those little caldercraft kits give an acceptable result for a moderate amount of work although it’s only a resin shell with a few attachments. As we “suffer” presently from a partly southern Californian climate here in central Switzerland (daytime temperature 35°C but about 500km to the next beach) I try to minimize the amount of any actual work.

 

 

Take care

Peter

[flyer]

Hi B.E.

 

Oops and I was secretly hoping that you could give a hint or at least an educated guess.

 

Well I presume that those supports were made by the ship’s carpenter according to the actual needs and the KISS rule. Therefore I will just set two short stubs in 45° angle, leaning towards each other, onto a beam. Two of those will lie across the spare spars (or inside the bigger boat) and  support the hull of the boat in 4 points.

 

Cheers

Peter

 

First try of a boat support

[Blue Ensign]

Sorry to disappoint Peter, but this is a tricky problem. Logic to us would dictate that some sort of chock arrangement would be fitted across the spare topmasts to seat the boat on.

 

My books contain a few photos of contemporary models with boats stowed on the booms and these don't seem to support that theory.

 

Here's a sixth Rate from 1745.

 You can't see all the boat, which I have seen in a book, but the boat sits down slightly between the booms and appears to simply be lashed to the booms.

 

Here's a shot of the Lowestoft model

 

Again no indication of any sort of chocking, the beam of the boat is supported by the booms and is held down by lashing.

 

You only tend to see one boat on the gallows on contemporary models, possibly because the larger one was towed?

 

Nesting of boats again seems to be a logical solution to a problem, but according to Lavery (Arming and Fitting of English Ships of War)

 

This is unlikely to have been done in the eighteenth century or before. Although  boats often had  some removable thwarts, these were intended to allow the carriage of casks, and there were enough fixed thwarts to make nesting very difficult. At least one thwart was fixed and kneed in midships to support the Mainmast.

 

He goes on to cite the case of a ships Pinnace which was often longer and narrower than the Longboat, making nesting impossible.

 

I'm dodging the problem by only showing one boat on the gallows

 

Cheers,

 

B.E.

 

 

[flyer]

Hi B.E.

 

If you really want to disappoint me, you must try much harder.   Again you had a lot of useful information.

 

I know Brian Lavery’s reputation (his book is still missing in my library – this will have to change) but the there are situations where I think you couldn’t pull any boat behind (e.g. very heavy weather). And logic tries to tell me that the ingenuity of the 18^th century carpenters should also find solutions for removable kneed thwarts (just fix the knees to the thwarts and put removable bolts trough the knees would work). While I don’t know B. Lavery’s sources I expect that for example the contemporary models would seldom show all the equipment as one boat would be sufficient  to represent all because everybody knew then where the rest was stowed.

 

By the way, I also noted the extensive use of red color on that contemporary model. All the deck furnishing and even the foot of the mainmast were red. That’s a bit too ‘bloody’ for my liking. Therefore I will have to bear the reputation of being a skipper which doesn’t like the usual amount of bloody color on his deck.

 

And I also noted that in both examples the spare spars are already painted – ready to use. This was another open question you provided with an answer.

 

On my Granado I also had the problem where to stow the boat (and such a vessel must have at least one boat). The solution there was to show it in the progress of being hoisted out hanging by the respective tackles. But this time I'd like to try something else.

 

For the time being I will work to stow the smaller boat inside the blue cutter on special supports and I will try for a solution to fix the blue cutter on the spars with a minimum of visible chocks but still in a conceivable way with a solid hold.

 

Thank you.

 

Cheers

Peter

Edited July 28, 2013 by flyer

[Mirabell61]

Hi Peter

a handsome build you have there, what time did it take you to date from keellaying on ?.

I like as well the figures climbing the shrouds and mast platforms. Are you using 25mm tall or 28 mm height ones ?

 

Nils

[flyer]

Hi Nils

 

Thank you.

 

The exact date of keel laying is lost in the mists of time. As a guess it was about three years ago. I’m still looking forward to my retirement (do I?) and work only sporadic on Pegasus.

 

The crew figures are Amati’s 25mm cast metal sailors, recommended for 1:64 to 1:76 scales. I get them via http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/acatalog/amati_crew.html

 

Cheers

Peter

[Mirabell61]

Thanks for replying Peter

 

I had some Problems with deckheights even though I worked 30mm from deck to deck over all 4 of them and with rather thin deckbeams. My Gage sample was the 1:64 resp. 28mm tall metal cast officer. Trust I will swap to 25 mm. The Pegasus should be capable of carrying 125 Crew and officers in total. I really can not imagine where they all found place, let allone the size of the pantry....., and the crowds and the smell in the hammock sleeping areas

 

Nils

[flyer]

Hallo Nils

 

If you take the descriptions in Patrick O’Brian’s books where height between decks was often closer to 150cm than your 192cm then you seem a very generous shipbuilder. Somewhere he writes something like ‘…height between decks was sufficient for men of average build, but only if you cut their legs at the knees…’.

 

The height between decks on USS Constitution is probably close to 180cm but on Rose/’Surprise’ its again somewhere near 160cm (except where the original structure was destroyed to make room for the film crew).

 

On plans of HMS Pandora I read about 165cm and on Granado, which has an unusual internal structure, you find between 150 and 190cm.

 

And shall we agree not to think about that smell? I know how an empty passenger aircraft smells when you switch off the air conditioning for a few hours. And those passengers are moderately civilized, clean, almost always use the modern toilets and even spoiled food is of good quality. No, let’s not think about the smell.

 

Cheers

Peter

[Mirabell61]

Hi Peter,

 

agree......

 

thanks for your explaining words on the deck hights, this allready provides some necessary Information to look out for the correct cast figure sizes, I have switched to 25mm figures now. ( providing and claiming 28mm tall figures by the sellers as 1:64 is inadequate and should be avoided)

 

Nils

[rdsaplala]

Beautiful work on the cutter, Peter, she's looking great, I really admire the amount of details that you and the other Pegasus/Fly builders are putting into your boats 

I am ashamed to confess that due to my lazy nature, I would probably use the Contemporary Swan Class Model in the link below as my excuse for not adding any boat to my ship: 

 

http://s3.amazonaws.com/magnoliasoft.imageweb/nmm/supersize/d4085-3.jpg

 

 

...Hi Aldo

 

Thanks for looking in.

I got the impression that you are taking a break in the work on your Pegasus, concentrating on your wonderful Triton. Another one lost to the dark art of scratch building…?

 

Take care

Peter

 

Thanks, Peter, I'll return to my Pegasus once I finish planking Triton

[texxn5]

Very nice build, glad I located it for reference.

[Ray]

Hi Peter

               I have added two photos the way I stowed the boats on my Pegasus no need for chocks on the smaller boat.

[riverboat]

Nice work on the  boats Peter, those kits are real nice . Your build is looking great!!

Frank

[flyer]

Hi Aldo

Well, if you really were that lazy you’d have another hobby.   And fiddling with boats is not worse than rigging cannons. And then you venture into scratch building and try to convice me that you are lazy!? Try again.

 

 

Hi John

Thank you!

 

 

Hi Ray

 

Thank you for the pictures. That’s a good trick but unfortunately I used it already on Granado and want to try something else.

 

The boat was stowed upside down on the mortar housing and as the ship is shown being prepared for firing the boat is being hoisted out.

 

Hi Frank

 

Thank you.

It was a hell of a work to scratch off all those barnacles and refresh the painting but now Pegasus is looking almost as good as new, isn’t she?

 

Cheers

Peter

[Blue Ensign]

Tht's a fine looking Granado Peter

B.E.

[flyer]

Hi B.E.

 

Thank you for the compliment.

After reestablishing normal disorder in my workshop (Now all my ship models are seeking shelter there because the complete reconstruction of our kitchen is not only affecting the eating habits but also the living room, where they usually berth. It has been transferred into’ living room – construction site – storage for kitchen utensils’.) I plan an thorough cleaning of Granado, to make some pictures and to put them into the gallery of finished ship models.

 

Cheers

Peter

[mobbsie]

Hi Peter,

 

Very impressive looking Granado mate, I built the CC kit and that didn't have a ships boat, the written word on it was that because she was a Bomb Vessel she would always be accompanied by other ships which would take her boats, they would then tender the Granado when she required ammunition ect.

 

I'm sure you will come up with the right decision for you with regard to the berthing of your ships boats.

 

Thanks for checking in on my log.

 

Hope the refurbs are going well, if nothing else protect those ships.

 

Looking forward to more updates when the time is right.

 

Be Good

 

mobbsie

[Martin W]

Hi Peter -- That is a very impressive Granado.  And I've enjoyed reading you log on the Pegasus as well -- you're a genuine craftsman.

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

[flyer]

Hi Mobbsie

 

Thanks. Yes, this is the CC Granado. Somewhere I read that note about not having no boat at all as well and I cannot believe it. Would you go skydiving without a parachute? But that’s not the correct analogy – it’s not a lifeboat. But you would need it continuously for communication with the shore or to run all that little errands which come up all the time. If you put two boats on a vessel as tiny as Pickle you should allow at least a small one even when Granado is fitted out as bomb vessel.

 

Cheers

Peter

[flyer]

Hi Martin

 

Thank you very much.

 

My real craft is flying which of course helps a lot when I tackle that flying horse.

 

 

Cheers

Peter

[flyer]

After a long break, work continued on the standing rigging of the foremast.

 

The last of the ratlines (for this project) were put in place on the fore topmast. Stays and backstays were put in according to the kit’s drawings.

 

A jib stay was added and put in according James Lees description ‘for smaller ships’. (No falls for the aft end of the stay and the outhauler – easier setup.)

 

 

The work continues under the watchful eye of the captain

 

 

Topmast stay tackle

 

 

Fore top

 

 

The block stropped to the starboard side of the fore topmast cap caries the jib stay

 

 

Traveller with jib stay and out hauler. The single block on the traveller is for the downhauler of the jib.

 

 

The standing rigging nears completion

 

 

 

[flyer]

Finally the last part of the standing rigging was done.

The fore topmast presented no special problems, except that I find it strange that the flagstaff- or royal stay has to be set up with an spliced eye at either end, leaving no easy way to tighten or loosen it.?

 

The way to install the bumpkins presented a riddle again. I wanted to have them lying on the bow head rail (and still ask myself if I should fix them there with an iron band). After several tries I found the present position. They just seem to look a bit too much forward; the angle to the bowsprit being closer to 30° than the 40° I estimate on plans.

 

Now I’m fixing some loose ends (ships boats, gun port lids etc.) while I think about how to make perfect sails with practically no hard work required...

 

 

Fore topmast top

 

 

Making one of the bobstays

 

 

Jib boom tip

 

 

I hope the position of those bumpkins is adequate

Edited April 1, 2014 by flyer

[Sailor1234567890]

That looks really nice. I love the sailors working all over her. Is that one sailor sleeping in the top?

[ZyXuz]

excellent works on the standing rigging

[Blue Ensign]

Hi Peter,

 

On the model the Bumkins are forced into that position by the absence of a 'False' Rail atop the Main Rail. The Bumkins should sit in a cut out on the False Rail, secured by a  capsquare.

 

I re-made the bumkins and imparted a slight downward curve in them whIch serves to reduce the sharp downward  angle you otherwise get.

 

Glad to see you're back on the build, the rigging is coming along very nicely.

 

B.E.

Edited December 17, 2013 by Blue Ensign

[Martin W]

That's very tidy work, Peter.  Your rigging makes me envy its consistency. 

 

Your bumkins look a lot stouter than the ones I have made for the Rattlesnake, so they'll surely be up to their task.

 

I also have to admire your traveller, which looks neat -- not an easy accomplishment, given the various lines that pass through it.

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

Edited December 18, 2013 by Martin W

[flyer]

Hi Sailor123…

 

Thanks. No, the bosun was just checking the top and the respective sailor claimed to be working.

Well, I’m sure, you know them sailors…   

 

Cheers

Peter

[flyer]

Hi ZyXuz

 

Thank You!

 

 

Hi Martin

 

Thank you. Yes, they seem a bit heavy. I will have time to consider a rebuild. That traveler really looks adequate for such a simple little addition. I ask myself why it isn’t provided with any kit.

 

 

Cheers

Peter