HMS Winchelsea by jfhealy - Fred's W2

[Rustyj]

Really nice Fred. Glad to see your progress!

[jfhealey]

Thank you JJ and Rusty and for all the likes.

 

I have finished planking the hull of W2 and it seems a good time to take stock. W2 is certainly a significant improvement on W1. That is mostly down to (a) much more accurate cutting and fitting of the bulkheads and frame (b) a better understanding of the way the model goes together and (c) more experience. But I am not completely happy.

 

Here are my thoughts so far:

1.If I lived in the USA I would not hesitate to buy the Syren bulkhead set but the cost, here in the UK , with shipping, import duty, VAT and handling fees is prohibitive. It is clear that accurate cutting, especially of the slots in the bulkheads is vital. Any inaccuracy in the slots in the main frame results, I think, only in the bulkheads leaning either forward or back and that is easily picked up and corrected at the gluing up stage. Any inaccuracy in the slots in the bulkheads, either cutting or filing the slots to get a snug fit, results in leaning side to side that is much more difficult to spot and correct.

2.On W1 I filled the spaces between the bulkheads with balsa and then skimmed the entire hull with filler. In effect I double planked W1. It may look a bit amateurish but, the many faults with planking on W1 there are no dips or high spots. I single planked W2 and rather regret doing so. There are dips and high spots. No doubt if I were better (not more careful – I took a lot of care) at bevelling I would have achieved a better outcome.

3.If I were to build W3 - and I am seriously thinking about it – I would not only double plank it as I did W1 but also line it out (as  Ben/Trussben  has done). It looks like a lot of work but I am sure it is worth it.

4.I I am not convinced about the white painted hull on W2. I did it, frankly, because the planking was not up to scratch. So far it has only had two coats of paint. I will give it a good sanding and a few more coats and see what I think. I don't dislike it: the real problem is that I know why I did it: to hide my son calls one of those " only you know it is there, dad" problems but a real problem nevertheless

5. Everything needs a jolly good cleanup and some paint and varnish and then I will see what I think. Just at the moment I can't shrug off, when I look at the superb parts to come in chapter 5 and, no doubt, subsequent chapters, the feeling that if I brought together the best of W1 and W2 I would have a pretty good foundation for going forward. W3 is therefore quite tempting.

 

 

The pictures below are W1.

 

 

These are W2

 

[Matt D]

Hi Fred.  It looks to me like you're past all of the problems associated with cutting out your own frames.  I'm sure you've seen numerous posts where I was whining about my own.  On mine, I can feel some imperfections in the hull, but it's very hard to see them.  I am pretty sure you can't see them in my photos.  Likewise, I can't see any in your photos.  I think you and I are both reaching the end of problems that we can blame on cutting out our own bulkheads.  My opinion is that you're in great shape.

[Edwardkenway]

I agree with Matt, in my humble amateur opinion, both W1 and W2 look fine, no!, more than fine, I would be happy with either version, but we all find faults with our own builds, that others may not see.

I know if I built another Winnie I would use liteply, not mdf, for the bulkheads, for ease of cutting and fairing.

At the end of the day it is your build and if you'd feel happier doing mk3, go for it.

Btw the white hull looks good and you have W1 wood so best of both🙂

[scrubbyj427]

I think it looks good Fred, it looks like you have lots of room to sand. Get yourself a nice set of Sanding blocks (foam and wood) and sand the hell out of it. It will level down pretty nice.

JJ

[AnobiumPunctatum]

14 hours ago, jfhealey said:

3.If I were to build W3 - and I am seriously thinking about it – I would not only double plank it as I did W1 but also line it out (as  Ben/Trussben  has done). It looks like a lot of work but I am sure it is worth it.

 

If you build a third version with your own cut bulheads I wouldn't recommend a second planking. For this you have to divide the thicknes of your planks. The thicker planks are looking much better than veneer. I recommend filling the area between the bukheads with basswood, similar to the narrow strips for the piece ports. After sanding you can fill all smaller mistakes to get a nice hull shape.

[jfhealey]

Thank you Matt, JJ, Edward and Christian. I remain in two minds about W2. One day I look at it and think it's looking fine. Another day I look at it and I can see what is lurking under the white paint. I have placed my order for the chapter 3 and chapter 4 parts this morning so I guess I will build W2 up to that stage and decide where to go. I suspect it is going to take some time for Chuck to produce the parts for chapter 5 and however many chapters remain after that so I could probably start W3 and catch up. The thing is there really is no other model on the market I really want to build (apart from Syren's Cheerful) and I am determined to get the bloody thing right!

 

Good luck all of you with your builds. I am following each with close interest and I share your trials and tribulations.

 

All the best

Fred

[scrubbyj427]

Fred, you’re going to have the Whole Niger Class On your workbench soon! You’re making me feel compelled to build another Winnie. Lol. Looking forward to more progress on W2.

JJ

[Chuck]

If you are going to paint the bottom white...I would highly recommend that you copy the style of the two contemporary models.   Make it so that the entire bottom under the wales is painted OR just leave that small area aft as shown below....The two top photos (Amazon)  is quite close to how we will fit out the Winnie by the way....as far as deck planking etc.  Just beautiful!!!

 

[scrubbyj427]

Let’s do Amazon next Chuck! Fine looking work of art!

 

You don’t plan to paint the bottom of Winnie white do you?

JJ

[Chuck]

No but only because I am not that adventurous...

 

One build at a time!!!

[jfhealey]

Thank you JJ. Start another Winnie - however good your first one is, and it looks great, they always come out better second time round.

 

Chuck - Could you offer some advice on this point? Where the hull is painted white on the contemporary models was it the fashion to leave the underlying planking visible (in the sense that the lie of the planks could be seen) or to sand/fill the hull to a completely flat smooth surface?

 

[Chuck]

You will never erase all traces of the planking run, but it should be very minimal.   You should get it very smooth or as smoot as possible.  Otherwise it has a tendency to look sloppy.

 

Chuck

[jfhealey]

Thank you Chuck - will do

Fred

[jfhealey]

The shells of the quarter galleries went in uneventfully.

 

I bought a length of aluminium bar from my local DIY store and clamped it down to the bulkheads to give me a really good straight edge centre line before fixing the false decks. 

 

The deck clamps end up where they are supposed to but only by leaving a small gap to the inner planking - no matter, that will be covered up with the panelling. I am not sure whether to paint the panelling. I suspect it should be painted – A pastel green or blue, perhaps, or ivory ( paint, that is, not the real thing like Matthias).

 

 

I used some small sticks as temporary deck beams to make sure the deck clamps were level and square with their opposite number.

 

 

I'm still undecided about the painted hull. I'm leaning towards following Chuck's advice to paint all the way up to the underside of the wales but it seems a shame to cover up wood. I'll leave it for a while. 

 

 

And here is one of those lovely Syren grating kits not yet glued nor the corners rounded off. I can't bring myself to paint these.

 

 

This is looking scruffy but should clean up really nicely and is so much better than W1.

 

 

 

And finally here is poor old W1 looking rather forlorn and abandoned (which it is).

 

[Chuck]

That is coming along well.   It looks really good.   Dont worry about the small gap in that inboard planking.   They do sell a cherry wood filler from Elmers that is terrific as well.   You wouldnt see it if you used that.

 

Chuck

[scrubbyj427]

Wow Fred, looks great. You are moving along nicely! 
JJ

[wyz]

I read through your build log this morning Fred, and it brought a smile to my face that yet another Winchelsea builder was willing to start the project anew or rip out a sizeable part of their model because they just weren't happy with their first effort.  That desire to "get it right" is commendable.  Fighting through mistakes is simply a part of model ship building.  It feels so good to rectify those screw-ups!  Fred, W2 is turning out nice.  Keep up the good work.

Tom

Edited March 7, 2021 by wyz

[jfhealey]

Thank you Tom. Model shipbuilding is a hobby I have taken up only comparatively recently and I am conscious, first, that I have so much to learn, and secondly, that if I do something twice generally turns out better second time. I'm not quite at the point of abandoning W2 and starting W3 but I do think about it from time to time. I'm determined to make the best possible job that I can of the Winchelsea. The trouble is (a) the more experience I gained, "making the best possible job" is a moving target and (b) I look at everyone else's logs and think "if only....".

 

I am intrigued, incidentally, Tom by your unique approach to the Winchelsea build and I shall follow your blog with keen interest.

 

In the meantime...........

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm not completely convinced by the painted panelling – but I cannot believe it would not have been painted. Surely there would is a modern fad?!

 

One advantage, of course, of painting the panelling is that you can use a little bit of filler to make good the seams. And paint can cover a multitude of modelling sins.

 

I do not like the unpainted bench seats and rudder trunk top. I'll paint those but I wonder if the bench seats should have hinged locker tops and whether the rudder trunk should also have an access hatch. Any thoughts, anyone?

 

The inside planking is pretty much done.

 

 

 

I made up one of the lovely Chapter 5 ladders. Here it is

 

 

Decking next.

 

All the best everyone

Fred

 

[scrubbyj427]

That looks good Fred, moving right along. I couldn’t even tell your panels were painted by the shade of light on them, I was going to ask if you carved your own. I’m still on the fence with painting mine... did you consider some weathering powder in the groves to help define the panels more? This is what I was thinking about doing. They look very nice.

I cant give advice on the rudder box or benches, I’d see if you can find any photos of the real thing.

JJ

[jfhealey]

Good evening everyone.

 

So many new builders starting off it's hard to keep up. It's a fantastic project. Good luck everyone!

 

I went for a rustic brick finish on the base for the stove.

 

 

I've started the deck planking. It feels like a really big step. When its done the majority of the "construction" bits  - the plywood - that need to be concealed will be concealed. 

The "tabs" are tricky and nowhere near perfect but they are as good as I could have hoped for and I'm  pleased.

 

 

 

I can't make up my mind about painting the comings. On balance i think I prefer them natural (too late to change my mind now anyway) though it may not be historically accurate and it is undeniably a lot of bare wood.

 

For the margin planks I tried edge bending  (It's asking a bit much I found), cutting from a single piece and cutting three pieces to make up the curve - so as to follow the grain. I went with the last.

 

 

 

[Ron Burns]

Fred, What a beautiful, beautiful ship you have here with your Winnie II! I agree with you, all of those gratings and ladders would cry out if painted. They look stunning!

[scrubbyj427]

Love the brick work Fred, how did you pull that off? You are moving along fast!!

 

JJ

[Chuck]

Coming along nicely.  Coamings are fine natural.  They look good.  The stove base is a bit of outlier though.  That wasnt the practice at that time as far as I can tell.  But it does look nice.  Usually black slate or a metal slab for English ships.

 

you will be so happy when the deck is planked.

 

Its like making the guns...you just cant wait til its over.  
 

 

[jfhealey]

Thank you chaps. 

JJ - I'm so sorry I missed your question regarding the panelling. No - I didn't use any weathering powder or fancy paint techniques ( I don't know any) to emphasise the laser etched lines. They are plenty deep enough to take 4 or 5 coats of paint and still retain definition. As to the stove base I used a sharp blade at 45 degrees to soften, without being too precious about it,  the very straight laser cut lines and then dry brushed on the brick colour after first painting the grey mortar colour. But I think I might paint them slate grey now - see Chuck's comments above.

[scrubbyj427]

Fred, your bricks look too good to paint over, take the small hit on accuracy in the name of eye candy for this one I think. 

[jfhealey]

Ah-ha. Just a little encouragement. That's what I wanted to hear. Thanks JJ. I'll keep the bricks.

On a quite unrelated topic: the chapter 5 instructions suggest a single plank down the centre line of the deck. The plans show two planks one either side of the centre line. I guess either is correct. I went for one either side.

[jfhealey]

Good morning all.

 

I have been working on the inside face of the transom. I cut away quite a lot of wood from beneath the window apertures so that I could fit in the cill leaving enough room to move the window frames in and out without having to cut down the frames.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Then I cut and fitted the cill

 

 

Incidentally, I recently purchased a new camera. I have not got the foggiest idea how it works yet: hence the out of focus images.

 

 

 

 

 

I can't decide whether to paint the windows and the cill. I think probably I shall – leaving the outside of the windows natural.

 

 In an idle moment I spent two minutes cutting the bulkheads in card just to see what the spaces look like only to find this morning that Chuck has now posted the real thing. Don't they look fantastic - Chuck's that is , not mine!

 

 

I have completed about half the deck. Completing that is the next job. 

 

Best wishes to all
Fred

 

 

 

 

 

 

[FrankWouts]

Your cabin will be very nice I think and is very inspiring!

[scrubbyj427]

Looks great Fred, I need to start the same carving project very soon, thanks for the roadmap.

JJ