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HMS Surprise, kit.


captain71
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I'm a confident modeler and have built  a few good boats, but This will be my first 18th century tall ship kit.  It's the HMS surprise. I know its a fictional ship , based on other ships. but I'm a Patrick O'Brien fan and have been waiting for a kit to come out.

I found one on eBay. that looks ok but just before I committed to buy. I got worried. Its a Chinese, laser cut kit 1:75 scale. I cant find a brand name in the description. if you go to eBay and look up HMS surprise kit. you'll see it. Its the $398.00 one and says Russian Federation. Does anyone have any info on this kit or know someone who bought it?

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That's a pirated kit by one of the ZHL companies and fronted by a Russian for sales.   See here:  http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/181-banned-kit-manufacturers-on-msw/

 

If you look carefully at the kit pictures, the wood is burned by the laser cutting.  They claim "Amati" kits but Amati doesn't package their kits in Chinese.  

 

If you buy it, you won't be allowed to do a build log as per the above link, MSW does not support piracy.

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Thanks for all your input on the HMS surprise kit. I'm glad I asked. I will never deal with disreputable companies' that pirate. I feel like a knuckle head for not knowing about these practices. Thanks for the warning and I've noted the list of companies to look out for. Glad I trusted my instincts.

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Ok, I found an HMS surprise kit. It's by Mamoli. 1:75th scale. Anyone know about this one. It's $449.00 and $119.00 more if I want the sails.

I don't know if talking prices is considered "not done" on these forums but it's quite an investment for me and I need to make sure I'm not getting a bad deal.

Edited by captain71
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Quick Google search on the Mamoli kit shows:

$500 on Amazon + $19 shipping.

$473 from Cornwell Model Boats in the UK + ?? shipping.

$459 from Model Expo (Special Order) + $25 shipping.

$475 from Modeller's Workshop.

 

So I'd say that $449 is pretty reasonable.  Certainly it's not overpriced based on what I found.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hello. Well Iv'e already dug in on my HMS Surprise 1:75 scale by Mamoli. I'm doing some lower decking now but I'm having a hellavatime identifying the wood. They have a color chart for the wood but that's pretty useless since they are all mostly shades of dark brown.. The measurements like 0, 5x4 mean nothing to me. if that,s millimeters, there are no such sizes in the kit. All the specification charts are in Italian. I've looked around the net and Thank goodness it's not just me. If anyone has put this one together, I'd appreciate alittle help with understanding the deck and planking descriptions and measurements.

Pictures of the  the laths are broken up into many types of wood and the shades are too subtle to use the chart. I tried too go by size but I dont understand the measurement chart. Maybe someone has figured this out and can give me a clue. Pictures even better. Thanks.  

 

                                                                                     Sincerly,  FNG

Edited by captain71
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Hi FNG,

 

I would suggest a build log as that's a good way to get help.  Have you checked out the other logs?

 

On the wood... generally those are mm.  So 0,5X4 is 0.5mm X 4mm.  They use the European style of decimals not the American.  The comma is the decimal point.

 

Here's two good links to sources online for translating: 

http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/7325-nautical-terms-italian-to-english/?hl=Italian

http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/5809-italian-dictionary-moved-by-moderator/?hl=italian

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As Mark has said, opening a build log would be a great help, there are plenty of knowledgeable members here that could help you solve problems that commonly arise from building model ships.

 

With regards to your kit's wood identification issues, European manufacturers generally use lime (pale cream colored, fine grain, soft) for first planking, walnut (brown and grainy) for second planking and tanganyika (pale yellow and grainy) for deck planking. That is of course a very general statement and it would be more helpful if you could take a few pictures of the timber as well as the chart and post it on this thread. 

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Thanks BilgeRat and ccoyle for the tip on searching the Build Logs. I found a guy "Waitoa"  that's just ahead of me on this Model. The wood issue seems the same for everyone. The Tanganyika, beach wood and box wood are all the same sizes and look exactly the same. The way I finally figured it out was to count the pieces required in each section and deduced the amounts of differn't woods it would require. Waitoa said he kinda took a chance and went for it. When I saw the planks he chose, I felt better about my plan. So thanks to Waitoa's courage, I hoisted anchor, spread canvas and and recovered my course.

I'll be starting a log soon. Been takin pics.

Edited by captain71
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Quite a few of us have.  Here's two links:  http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/2143-san-diego-maritime-museum/

http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/2141-pictures-san-diego-maritime-museum-movedretitled-by-moderator/

 

I thought there was more... hmm... 

 

It's well worth the visit to see not just Surprise (ok.. HMS Rose replica) but the models, the Star of India, etc.   I'm not far north of you and if I could get there, you can too.  :)  :)  :)

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  • 1 month later...
  • 4 months later...

post-16801-0-76045400-1433880272_thumb.jpgpost-16801-0-89099900-1433880336_thumb.jpgGetting alittle confused about attaching the transom. I calls for a 2mm slit between the blocks and the frame.?  Also, are the cut outs in the bottom of the transom  supposed to fit into the notched out end of the gun deck? If so, they are way off and need to be re cut. anyone have pictures or better plans?

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I built the Mamoli Surprise as far as the gun deck and have stopped at that point.  I'm trying to figure out how to rig guns to metal gun port frames.  Really disappointed with this kit so I ordered the AL Surprise from Amazon and currently in the process of building the frame.  Much  happier.  It may sound silly but you can eliminate a lot of the confusion on the wood issue if you count the pieces and then label them yourself.  It isn't foolproof but it will help,

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  • 3 weeks later...

I built the Mamoli Surprise a few years ago... What an exercise.. I had to learn/teach myself lots of new techniques..

especially for installing the guns on the lower gun deck.. 

 

DO NOT put the weather deck in when  the instructions say to.. If you do, you'll never get the gun deck populated..

I'll be happy to share what I learned if you need help...

 

Here are some photos.. 

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post-945-0-66154100-1435694764_thumb.jpg

post-945-0-37577000-1435694765_thumb.jpg

post-945-0-21209100-1435694766_thumb.jpg

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Hi

 

Currently at this point in my build. Ditched the metal brackets for gun ports and boxing them myself. Lots more work but think it looks better. Also not putting on the top deck and transom until I have finished the second planking on the outside. Keen to finish and paint this so I can install the guns first. Did post some progress pictures a few weeks ago and can put some more on if it helps.

 

Waitoa

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I probably should have ditched the metal frames, too.. But I didn't know enough..  So:

 

1) I prepositioned the frames using the guide notches in the deck...

 

2) assembled the guns/carriages but didn't glue the barrels in place

 

3) used the gun/carriage assemblies (port and strbd) to align and secure the frames at the right height.  

 

4) Glued the carriages in place..

 

5)  removed the barrels and set aside  until later

 

6) Finished 1st planking the hull such that the planking fit in with the gun port frames and then sanded everything smooth and flush...

 

 

7) Installed the weather decking and the gunwales

 

8) did the second planking so that the gun port doors would fit flush into the hull when closed...

 

9) when the entire model was finished and painted     I used a tweezer  to insert the gun barrels onto  their carriages through the open port.. and used CYA to fix them in place  ( one drop on each pivot works great)

 

10) then the port doors were attached..

 

11) Then came the rigging, being VERY  careful not to dislodge a gun barrel..

 

Note: an assembled gun/carriage will not fit through the port  ..  

 

 

Might not have been the simplest approach  ... but it worked...

Edited by Desert_Sailor
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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 1 month later...

Fun with guns, I should be reading this more often. I followed the instructions, started the hull planking with the first plank bottom even with the bottom of the gun deck. Then came up to put the plank that the gun ports are to rest on top of that and there wasn't enough room for the guns ports... So took first plank off reinstalled gun port support plank and have installed ports. Then realised that if I don't attach the guns to the carriages I won't be able to get them in after planking. The problem is that you can't sand the gun ports to be flush with the planking with the guns sticking out. So I am now removing the weather deck to have access. At least reading the recent posts I see that we're all in the same boat. Thanks all. :)

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