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Chuck

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Everything posted by Chuck

  1. You can almost tie planking strips into a knot. Its very very flexible. And really strong as well.
  2. Not a problem...I am very busy doing research on the rig as we speak.. I have made contact with the builders and crew of an 18th century longboat replica out of Halifax. They are preparing a long journey in 2020 and I am discussing some details about their rig and how they developed it. I am sure they have it rigged fairly consistent with early practice although this replica is a bit later from 1770's. Contemporary drawing of rigged longboat....useful for number of reef points and panels circa 1760-70.
  3. To better explain my dilemma... Here is a look at the cont model rudder. Its original. Here is the other cont model rigged. This is NOT the original rudder and was made as a restoration following the other model. This is the way it should be in actuality. Like my barge kit. Note the indent in the stern post which draws the rudder closer to the stern post. Its a very simple fix....but really does have a different look than the contemporary models. Should I just present the problem and allow the builder to choose which arrangement they want. By the way...that is the original rigging on that contemporary model. And the sheet and horse arrangement is 100% correct. So to change that would be to change it to something very wrong for this boat. A very different issue than the rudder hinge which is modeled that way as modelling convention that the contemporary builder used. The third possibility and probably the best one as it is less of a departure maybe. This is an original draft from around the same time that shows a way that I can keep the hull and stern post the same as the contemporary models but then change the shape of the rudder to have the indents instead. These are for the pintles and gudgeons and will also draw the rudder closer to the stern post. This would be my compromise if I decided to make the change and deviate from the contemporary models. I hope I fleshed out an example of one dilemma that I face among dozens on all my projects like this. Damned if you do...damned if you dont. So in the end as long as I explain the situation, you guys would know where I am coming from and can use any of the above to suit your fancy.
  4. It depends....sometimes they are not errors. Like the rigging plan. In other instances they are not errors either....for example the rudder. Its just a modeling convention they used. You see this a lot in contemporary models. They used certain model conventions and I think they are just fine in most instances. The contemporary builder didnt do it wrong because he didnt know how to do it. He probably could have literally walked down the street and taken a look at the original. It makes for a model that is less sterile in my opinion, and to me has a different look.....artistic value. But others who want to "kitchen sink" a model with every last historically accurate detail even though you wouldnt commonly see them on contemporary models...it tends to make some projects very sterile and busy....clinical. I wrestle with this all the time. I ask myself all the time, if I change this or that to make it appeal to the purist of clinical naval architects among us...will the model I am building loose what I love so much about the contemporary model I use as inspiration. I hope that makes sense. My time in art school has trained me to look at things differently than say an engineer would. I know many many engineers who model and they love to insist on adding every doodad and detail just like it should be....That is awesome for them. But its not my cup of tea. We have hearty debates over it all the time. But who knows, maybe I will continue to match those beautiful models because they are works of art in my opinion...but talk about and create an alternative drawing or notation for folks that are more like my engineer friends....its just a bit clinical for me.
  5. We shall see when the time comes. I may stick with the same rigging plan though as it is what they used back then. But I am talking to some folks and will see how horrible it would be to deviate from the contemporary models since this is actually a model of a model. But since they dont have sails maybe I have some wiggle room. There are a few things that are off on the contemporary models and one is the way the rudder is attached on both models. There are no notches in the rudder or the stern post to accept the hinges. Now do I correct that or shall I be faitful to the contemporary models....or just see how folks bash it and deviate based on their own desires. Lots of questions and deliberations as I design a new kit.
  6. No sorry Alan....too much redrafting to switch scales. It would just be too small to do accurately also. To keep it in scale the frames would need to be 1/32" thick if not thinner. Thats why I wanted to do this larger version. I had to compromise on that older 1:48 ME kit. Using basswod as is done in that kit the frames needed to be made 1/16" thick which is huge so they wouldnt break immediately. At full size that would be 4" thick. Did you ever see a long boat with 4 x 4 lumber for frames?
  7. I actually just caught a small error in my first go-around. More like an omission. If you examine the contemporary examples, you will notice that the unrigged model doesnt have holes on the top of the stem for rigging the stay. But the rigged version does. So rather than start over....I will use that first model I started as my unrigged version. I will add the holes on both moving forward however...and I am glad I didnnt start building my other version yet. But maybe tomorrow.
  8. I am going to build both as well. I think that having an unrigged partially planked version like the NMM photo would make a nice presentation. The partially planked version will remain unrigged so displaying them both together might be very interesting. When my local club starts building it together as a group I will have build a second one anyway.....to show folks up close how I did this-or-that. Chuck
  9. Both ways....there will be a version that is completely planked also. But I figured making one that compliments the barge was also a good idea.
  10. That is exactly why I left the char in place on all of those scarf joints. Since the parts were all designed to fit tightly its also good to not sand them at all so the fit remains tight.
  11. Unfortunately my best recommendation would be to start over and just use some strips glued across the tops of the frames.....it works the best and the blocks are overkill. More trouble than its worth as you will no doubt see when it comes time to remove them. I would also make a more general recommendation....try not to over think it and over complicate it. Sometimes the simpler solutions already tried do the trick just fine. There are over 50 longboat build logs I think....I dont think any of them approached it like this so you are in new territory here. As you are trying to find methods for a beginner and new builder....using those blocks creates a situation that will no doubt be frustrating and very tough to rectify once the hull is completely planked over. There will be very little room to get tools inbetween the frames or even get alcohol deep enough to soften the bond. Then one must pry up and out.....to try and avoid breaking the thin and fragile basswood frames because you wont be able to use any fore-aft motion to remove them. At least not initially. It will be very interesting to see how they are removed after planking, but again "I fully recommend that a beginner stay clear of this approach to stabilizing the frames"
  12. Not including bowsprit about 15" so it is NOT a small model. Should look very good indeed fully rigged and about 23" or so. I will know exactly once I develop the rigging plan. I am very fond of 220 grit sandpaper to remove char. I dont scrape. It is really not that much of a chore if you are willing to discard your sandpaper the moment it gets clogged and "muddied" with char. Otherwise you are just pushing the char dust into the wood grain of your pieces and it makes a mess. I always do a preliminary sanding with the paper to remove most of it along an edge and then switch to a clean piece of sandpaper to finish it up. Different woods react differently to laser cutting. Cherry and Pear being among the worst. They burn really bad and deep. The yellow cedar on the other hand is really good. There are natural oild that help prevent deep burning. Only a light amber residue on most thinner pieces and the thicker ones are still not that bad to clean up. Look at the notches in the last photo that the frames will sit in. You can get a good idea. I didnt remove any char from those at all and you can see the color is light and it is pretty clean from the start. Chuck
  13. This new larger longboat model will be build just like the Queen Anne Barge. All parts whenever possible will be laser cut including the planking which will be pre-spiled. Below is the plan in progress as compared to the actual contemporary model. Below are the initial parts that make up the keel assembly. There will be a more simplified version of the keel assembly and another that is lightly more chalenging. As is done on the contemporary model, lap joints will be used to connect the stem and stern post to the keel. The simplified version will just utilize a butt joint and laser cut scarph joint to attach the stem to the keel. I have started building the simplified version first shown on top of the photo below. Before removing the laser cut parts from the sheet, they were sanded down with 220 grit sandpaper on both sides to remove the char. Its easier to do while they are still contained in the sheet. Then the three main (5/32" thick) parts that comprise the stem, the keel and stern post were assembled. I used yellow glue to assemble them prior to sanding the char from the edges of each piece. In fact I purposely didnt remove it from the joints...they are laser cut fairly precise and fit together very well. Using tite-bond works great and the joint is very strong as long as you let it fully dry. Once dry I sanded the char from all of the edges and prepared to add the other (3/32" thick) cedar parts that make up the keel assembly. These were treated the same way. I didnt remove any char from the edges util after they were glued into position. They are very delicate and it is safer and easier to do after they are glued into position. These thinner pieces were centered along the keel leaving 1/32" on each side to form a rabbet or "lip" for the external planking. Next up I added the transom...it has a laser etched groove down the inside to help position it properly. It helps a lot but I was also very careful to also square up the transom properly in relation to the keel. Thats it for now....I have one last part to add to this stem assembly before I start assembling the frames. I will post that very soon.
  14. This is the start of my build for the Medway Longboat. There are two really special contemporary models in the NMM. This is a totally revamped and completely new longboat project with actually little in common with my earlier design for Model Shipways. It is based on an entirely different original draft and more closely resembles the contemporary models. In fact its almost identical as far as I can tell. It will be a true POF model with floors and top timbers. This model will be made from Alaskan Yellow Cedar with boxwood accents and molding. This model will be made both partially planked and fully planked eventually just like the two contemporary models. The fully planked version will show all rigging and also sails. Hopefully. A little about the contemporary models shown below. Scale 1:48. A contemporary full hull model of a ship's longboat, said to be from the 'Medway' (1742) (SLR0328), built plank on frame in the Navy Board style. The model is partially planked and equipped with a large windlass amidships for use when handling the anchors. It is mounted on its original veneered baseboard. Another model, SLR0330, shows the ‘Medway’ longboat rigged and fully planked. The longboat was generally the largest boat carried on board ship and could either be pulled or sailed. It was used for carrying personnel and stores as well as mooring and anchors work. When carried on board, the longboat was stowed in the waist between the fore and main masts lashed on the spare topmasts and spars. It was hoisted in and out by means of the large block and tackles rigged to the lower fore and main yards. A contemporary full hull model of the 'Medway' (1742), shown below - 60-gun two-decker ship of the line
  15. If you click on the topic below it contains links to indexes of every build log on our forum for kits. These are downloadable PDF indexes with links to every build log in alpha order. There are six revenge kit logs but no Sao Miguel which should probably tell you something right there.
  16. Look below this topic in the same forum and you will see two reviews that Jim posted....
  17. To give Carl and everyone a better idea of what you guys are free to propose in the way of a group project see this Mock sample proposal. Any of you folks can create a stand alone topic such as this one to lay out and propose any project. If you get the six or more participants then we will gladly set up the group for you. If you need any help along the way just ask. So as Kurt proposed....a Sharpie build....he should start a topic with similar information to rally support. Name a person who will be leading the group....hopefully the authors and designers. But these groups dont run themselves....so you or another person who will lead this group should try and organize it and create a detailed proposal for it as a stand alone topic. As Carl proposed...get together with Russ and flesh out some ideas on a Biloxi schooner and create a proposal topic to rally six members. Its really that easy and nobody has to be shy here. Just start a "PROPOSAL" topic but please lay out the details of the project so that everyone knows what it entails and who will be leading the group. If you are proposing a group and cant find a mentor/leader then contact us and we will try and find one for you. Important:You cant have a group project without a leader who will run it and hopefully mentor the builders. One who has some expertise on the subject and will dedicate some time and energy to keep it organized. Post tutorials for certain aspects or post info that will be useful to the group. Without a leader for a group.....we dont have a group. Its a requirement. For example...see the intro to simple carving group I started and assumed the role of group moderator or leader for. If on the other hand you have an idea for a group and wish to start one for let say.....an ice boat....but no commercially available plans or kits exist. Then still create a proposal. And if there is enough support for it the NRG may use some funding to help create one. This particular topic and poll was created to gather information on what people are willing to accept....prefering to build...and possibly be expected to pay....for a group as a general top-level discussion. Hopefully it will give the Admin and NRG some ideas should no members ever create a proposal. I urge all of you to do so!!! You never know, maybe there are dozens who also had the same though but never said anything. Basic rules for creating a proposal are written here....
  18. Actually the Longboat is not a difficult build at all. At least not with the new design. But the goal here is create groups for all ranges of expertise. I would say that this group taking shape would be in the intermediate range. It will have pre spiled and laser cut planks for example. No carvings etc. A smallish subject done plank and bulkhead style would be a perfect choice for a beginner or someone on their second or maybe third model.....but we dont have any designed yet. They are in the works as soon as we can identify a subject that fits the bill. Then we will put one together. The ones I listed were only done because those projects are completed already or nearly completed and a group can be started sooner. Any yet- to- be named beginner-centric subject has yet to be developed. That of course wouldnt rule out six to 10 members who consider themselves beginners from organizing themselves and selecting an already available kit choice on the market and asking a suitable mentor to build it alongside them and guide them through the process. But once again.....our membership must speak up and suggest such a scenario so we can help them get it together. Carl, If you have such a project in mind...please let us know. Organize and gather some support for it. That can and should be done in this forum and you are free to create a topic to rally support. That is actually what this topic is trying to find out..because my attempts to ask our members to step up and start a topic to organize their own groups never happened..too shy perhaps..but we need folks to speak up and based on those that have already done so, we have the choices chosen thus far. Read the other topic in this forum which spells out how any member can try and organize a group build of their own!!!
  19. There will be a full kit available yes....but maybe some folks dont want the whole thing. Anyway, we shall see when we get that far. I was only thinking of offering a partial starter with frame and keel parts for anyone wishing to scratch the rest of it for the group project and save a little money. I probably wouldnt even list it on my site and only offer the starter here on MSW for the group.
  20. Great thank you...remember it will be a few months before its finalized. I am curious though rcmdrvr, why did you select that you are not interested in any of the projects in the poll above.
  21. No delay ...no additional costs other than what it would cost to ship stuff as usual.
  22. Wonderful work.....beautiful ship model. I would strongly urge to start a build log for this model if you are still building it. I for one would love to see more of it. The cedar looks fabulous.
  23. Not for frames.....I wont place the frame drawings on the plans for obvious reasons. In two weeks you would see a pirated kit on Aliexpress......and you would suddenly see the pirated kits being built on another forum with no mention or whisper about its actual origin. For my own project designs moving forward you will always need to purchase a starter package at a minimum.......it is unfortunately the only way to protect yourself these days...and you are really never fully protected.
  24. Thanks for letting me know. It will be a few months before its finalized but yes it will be at least a starter package with framing and keel. This longboat is much more simplified than something like the barge. It doesnt have nearly the complexity. I can produce a starter package very easily but like the barge I can also produce a full kit version. I plan on pre spiling all of the planking and providing laser cut parts for every single part of the long boat just like the barge but in reality they can be made from scratch if templates are provided. Chuck
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