Chuck

Yes indeed that is the Model shipways solid hull kit, Essex....I think we have one in the Gallery....Here are some comparison images...just the paint colors are different. From the early 60's or 70's and possibly even the early 80's. It was made in two scales...1/8" scale was the first version and that could be as old as the 50's but this is clearly the 5/32" version. It may have been built later because I see some of the earmarks spelled out in Jim Roberts book on building the kit. Which buy todays standards was just a min practicum on building the kit. Many of the details on your old model are dead ringers for what he wrote about. The figurehead is also a dead give away...you see, the metal casting...lead at the time was very soft. The hatchet or axe the Indian was supposed to hold in his hand was always bent or broken and had to be replaced. It is why it may appear slightly different on models that were completed. But the body is a perfect copy with its flowing cape. I may even have one laying around the shop. Comparison

Discussions are good I think Jim simplified it for model builders Keep in mind the use of the term Margin plank in my instructions...it is yet another simplification. Essentially the waterway at this time was a very wide plank that had a raised lip on its outer edge....one piece To simply it and model it in two pieces, I refer to it in the Confederacy instructions as two separate parts....the waterway being a thin rounded piece placed over what I describe as "the margin plank". The thin piece becoming the raised lip. But essentially they were one piece and properly identified as the waterway...one piece.... I hope that makes sense. I have never seen a rounded bow with deck planking that wasnt hook scarfed or later nibbed into this waterway because it would create really thin pointy deck planks which are prone to rot very quickly. If someone can help me explain it better that would be great. A really great explanation and example can be found in Danny's log here http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/230-hms-vulture-by-dan-vadas-1776-148-scale-16-gun-swan-class-sloop-from-tffm-plans/page-5#entry5230

Wq3296...interesting but I have never heard of that before or seen any primary sources that show it done that way...without a margin plank that is... Do you have any other sources besides the Jim roberts book. At this early time I have always seen a margin plank (wide waterway plank) for English Frigates and larger. For a Bermuda sloop I am not as certain....but I would include it. Jim just breezed over the topic of deck planking in that book writing about a page and a half. No illustrations or mention of time periods etc. Or which decks. I am also just talking about round bowed weather decks from the period...not a forecastle deck such as shown on ships like Bellona with a beakhead bulkhead. That was handled slightly different across the flat end on the forward side of the focastle deck. But the lower decks as far as know would have been scarfed and hooked as I have shown with a wide waterway/margin plank. Jim Roberts was entirely too brief on the subject...But I would love to see additional sources about it. See this image There was no reason to use hooked planks on the forecastle deck above....however the lower decks I assumed were done just as described and shown in the earlier post of the frigate Minerva. But the waterway/margin was very wide. It is perfectly described in the Fully Framed series...Volume one for the lower decks and Volume two for the weather decks Chuck

David Antscherl's Swan series......Volume two I believe. I am not sure if there is a how-to but he shows the layout clearly and talks about. At any rate, a fantastic reference to have for this period all around. I also showed how I do it in the instructions for the confederacy... http://modelshipworldforum.com/resources/Confed/Chapter10.pdf Chuck

Nope...Just name it properly and you are good to go...A good name would be one like I posted below. Civil War Ironclad, USS St. Louis - 1:24 POF - Gateway Model Shipcrafter's Guild I am looking forward to it. Chuck

Kieth Have a look at the images from the NMM website. The planks werent nibbed at all around this time. They were "hooked" alongside the margin plank. See this image....also, the planks were curved and tapered slightly at the bow. You can see the curve here... The second photo shows a hooked or scarphed end to the plank against the margin. Both models are contemporary....and to the period we are discussing. These are considered primary sources...any secondary sources written by Roberts, Goodwin or anyone else is not nearly as weighted. If I had to choose the more accurate...I would stick with the primary sources from the time period every time. It is very hard to argue against those. Chuck

I will make an adjustment to my materials sheet.

That little side to side difference wont matter. I would try and just open the slots up evenly on both sides. Use a sanding stick that is pretty large with some coarse sandpaper glued to it. I just ordered a bunch of plywood so hopefully it will be the correct thickness. If time permits I may cut some sets if the thickness is OK. Its midwest ply...not the 6mm stuff. You must look for actual 1/4" thick stuff. Dont forget to download the first chapter of the monograph online. I just added it and plan to get the others written within a week or so until I am caught up with my progress thus far. One important thing I always mention is for the builder to always measure the thickness of the ply before they start cutting. This way they can make adjustments to the slots before they start making sawdust. Its awful trying to find accurate good quality ply. It looks good so far though.... Chuck

Ouch!! Those are awful

Could be pau marfim.....

That is a fantastic start....

That looks fine Rusty. Nice save on the gallery counter. They are tricky buggers. The hard part is making sure the angle is correct so the windows fit OK. Luckily...if your windows for the galleries need some tweaking, I can just make some adjustments and cut you new ones. So dont fret about that. All you would need to do is send me some templates with the correct angles. Chuck

I have uploaded the Sultana practicum here..... http://modelshipworldforum.com/ship-model-build-and-practicums.php Chuck I will add the Phantom in a little while. Once I find it...I know its here somewhere.

If they dont put them back on the site I will fish around for the master CD;'s I have and place them somewhere on this site. Chuck

Looking great Dan...Have a great vacation Chuck

Thanks Guys Christian...I wont be plating the hull. She probably was copper plated but few contemporary models including the Surly ...They were not plated. The Surly model was painted with white stuff. I couldnt find anything definitive about it so I am going to leave the hull as is. Chuck

Thank you Alistair Red is a very transparent color to paint with. If you use thin coats it will be somewhat transparent. I have many more coats and more sanding to get it where I want but it will most likely have some transparency. I found some workshop time....so I finished planking the starboard side. Its a big milestone but then I look at the port side and have to repeat the entire process, including the square tuck But it all worked out very well. Once the other side is finished I can start treenailing.

The Square tuck....Thank goodness this isnt a real POF project. Here is the simplified version. The photo below shows the first beam added which to create teh base for the stern post. It runs down the center of the square tuck so I can glue the stern post on later. It is 1/8" thick and 7/32" wide. The same width as the stern post The same photo below shows the second timber....how I took a wider piece that was 1/8" thick. I shaped it so the seam between the lower counter and this timber was very tight. Then I measured and marked it so it would be 1/8" wide as well. This will of course be repeated on the other side once it is planked. The finished timber below. Then it was time to create the side piece which will finish the square tuck frame....this was the hardest piece but not that difficult at all. I just took a larger 1/8" thick piece of boxwood and shaped it to fit tightly against the two timbers I just just completed. I tried to get real tight seams. At the same time, it hangs off the side of the hull. Then I traced the shape of the hull against the back of this piece. Heres what the tracing looks like. The piece was cut to shape on the scroll saw. Then, this piece was temporarily glued back in position with just a small dot of CA. This was done because it will need to be removed after it is faired with the hull planking. See below. And as done before, I drew another line to establish a 1/8" wide finished timber. This was cut out and glued into position finishing the frame for the square tuck on this side of the hull. Here is what it looks like. Finally....it was planked inside with vertical planks the same width as the hull planking. Tarred seams were simulated. I was very careful to get very tight seams. In actual practice these planks would be normal thickness and the ends resting in a rabbet along the edges of the square tuck frame. In my case though, I just faked it using planking that was actually 1/8" thick which is the same thickness as the frame. It all worked out in the end. I am quite pleased with the results as this is normally a really tough detail to model convincingly. Now to touch up the red paint on the counter or maybe its just best to wait till the planking is all done. I can now start planking the last belt on the starboard side.

Thanks Any art store will have the pinstripe tape. Graphic arts tape... Clinker planking may in fact be easier for you but in the case of the Cheerful it would just be wrong historically. I find it difficult to clinker plank a hull. I havent seen many hulls that are done properly or to my satisfaction...so I chose a carvel planked hull. I think most model builders prefer this anyway. Its what they are used to.

I think that little bit wont matter. You may have to adjust the slot widths in the bulkheads and bulkhead former...but thats it. The plans for example call for 1/16" thick planking....because its a readily available size....but because I am milling my own stock, the planks are actually 3/64" thick. That is closer to scale and easier to work with. So feel free as I have done to change things up. As long as you think ahead or shoot me the question before hand, you should be good to go. Again this is the beauty of a scratch build. You have some flexibility as long as you think through the consequences. Following the plans will do the trick...when you adjust any wood sizes...think about what you will need to adjust on the plans....but it may not even be needed. Chuck

Yes but its easy enough to do the conversion....in fact there are many translators on the web for free. You type in the imperial number and it gives you the metric equivalent. If its close you will be good to go. I wish I could do more but short of doing the translations myself for every part and material (which I wont do) I dont see how it could cause a problem. Use this chart http://mdmetric.com/tech/cvtcht.htm Couldnt you order your wood in in imperial measurements if they are being milled for you in the UK? If I ask say Jeff to cut me stock at 3mm thick he will certainly do that. Wouldnt a source in the UK do that too but in reverse? If not, just use the chart to convert before ordering. But I cant take the time to do this many conversions. You will have to print out the chart when ordering your wood and possibly order a ruler or two with imperial measurements on it for the project. Then you are good to go. All materials will be listed in the monograph with imperial sizes when I use them....so you will know how large to cut stuff by using your new imperial ruler of measurement. All of my rulers have metric on one side and imperial on the other so I dont see why it causes a problem if you had one of these and used a conversion chart. I do it all the time. Chuck

I am not sure what you mean....wood list or materials list??? Since its a scratch project more or less there are no parts to inventory. Except for those few I mentioned so far. As far as a wood list goes...I do have a preliminary. I wont know for certain until after I build her. Its impossible to know before its built with 100% certainty. The wood list I have used and stocked up on are as follows. It should be very close. Remember that this is not a kit. 1/4" Ply 4' x 4' All boxwood sheets are 24" long......and 3" wide 7/32" Boxwood sheet 2 1/4" ........1 1/8" ........2 5/32" .......2 3/16 .........5 1/16" .......3 1/32" .......3 .025 ........1 3/32" ........1 but maybe 2 sheets depending. One 3/8" x 3/8" strip for the lower mast 24" long Basswood sheets.... 1/32" ....two sheets 1/16" ...2 sheets

And one last image of the contemporary planking expansion detail. It shows the square tuck pretty well. For those that might have one on there model although its unlikely. I have never seen a kit that shows one. They are usually left off because they can be rather complex. You can also see the number of planks....twenty which matches my model exactly. Ten down to the bottom of the square tuck and ten more below that. Hence the two planking belts I used. Chuck

Thanks Its all Boxwood and from Hobbymill. Jeff was kind enough to cut me all the wood for the lower planking and the remainder of the project from a really nice piece. Its the best boxwood I have ever seen. Heres a picture...I should have waited so I could use this better stuff above teh wales...but most of that will be covered up anyway. So it should be OK. Chuck OH and another not so flattering image of the square tuck on that contemporary model. Lots of cracks and damage. It looks pretty beat up. Also the last photo shows teh cheerful drawing I made.....you can see the differences I dont think its the original blue paint on that model. My reason is that you can see bits of it within the splits and cracks which means it was painted after the cracks developed.

Jan The square tuck frame should be rabbeted so the hull planking and square tuck planking has the the butt ends protected from the elements. The lower counter planking has its butt ends protected by the fashion pieces. The strip between the lower counter and the square tuck is just a fancy molding strip and cosmetic. I have about 40 pictures of this model from every conceivable angle. Just havent had the time to reduce them so I can post them. But if you want to see any particular area let me know and I will reduce and post those....If you click on the picture above in that post it gets really big...you can see that detail..The fancy molding strip is placed too low however on that model in my opinion. The frame for the square tuck needs to be a consistent width all of the way around to look good. Thats the hard part but in a few steps it can be done without incident. Chuck