chris watton

Checking figurehead in relation to bowsprit, and the fit of the new stove. Pics not too flattering, but this hull is only used as a basis to check important parts and finalising the more important aspects of the hull designs. So now, I know that the whole hull goes together very well, all the gun and upper deck beams fit perfectly, and the bulkheads will give a nice run for the outer planking.

Also inner bulwarks shown, these do take an age to get right, due to curves and the amount of upper deck beam slots. These are cut and checked using ply, but kit version will have pear versions, engraved and all positions marks or cut for all inner bulwark fittings - I always hated having to plank inner bulwarks, very awkward and there was always the real chance of some planks splitting or breaking off when filing the ports - not anymore!

57 minutes ago, Kusawa2000 said:

Did I remember correct that the deck maybe have a option of laser etched for the deck planks or you can go for individually planked?

Also... the Inner bulwarks pre cut and etched.. that would take care of a few headaches! 

 

Pear on exterior planks.. wow.. that will give a nice finish.👍

The decks will be 0.8 or 1mm limewood laser cut and etched as standard in the kit, as this is what it will be designed for. however, as I have said before, this does not stop anyone wanting to plank the decks themselves using planking of their choice. They can use either the laser etched decks or printed full size deck patterns on the plans as templates if they so wish.

I used to use maple veneer, which was really nice - problem was I could not have enough sheets in a nice neutral colour tone, so reject rate was way too high.

All of my kits have pear as the finishing planking for the hull, be it in pre cut or planking form.

28 minutes ago, Kusawa2000 said:

Chris: Is it going to be a single plank on bulkhead or double? I cant remember what you had done with your past kits...

 

 

As a rule, double planked. Inner bulwarks will be fully pre cut and etched parts, though. Decks will be laser etched and cut limewood with no ply sub decks needed.

I am thinking of just doing a single pear planking for the upper outer hull, and double planked at and below the thicker plank line (roughly where a main wale would start on an English ship) - But not sure yet...

And back to Surprise. These pics show the checking of the inner bulwark template (no gun port cut outs yet), and how it aligns with the upper deck beams. Once I know the fit is as good as it's going to be, I shall do the next version with gun ports and then check again.

(Ply gun deck is not part of the final kit)

For this design, I beefed up the bow structure a lot more than usual, as I know this can be a weak point when planking..

25 minutes ago, westwood said:

So does this confirm the development of the Tiger 1681 from Richard Endsor's drawings?

Maybe!  Richard Endsor did very kindly produce a set of 64th plans for me.

26 minutes ago, westwood said:

The scale is 1/64 ? Will the stove and cannons be sold separately and also in 1/48th scale?

I am not sure yet, the issue I now have is time and space to store stuff that isn't related to my kits in 64th

7 minutes ago, Kenchington said:

Both very neat and very interesting! Do you have a source for that stove design or was it someone's imagination? The brick galley fireplaces I have seen reported in the archaeological literature (and the only one I have personally handled) were all much simpler.

 

Trevor

Of course I have a source for the stove!

2 minutes ago, François de Saint Nazaire said:

Hello Chris

 

Could you tell more about this project ? 😉

 

Is it a Stove from the 17th century or 18th century ?

 

The arming and fitting of English ships of war, 1600-1815
by Laveny, Brian :
 

I did mention that it is from the 17th Century in my post, and is for a future development of a 17th century warship.

And now for something completely different.
When I need other people, more skilled than me in other disciplines, to do work for me for future developments, I like to get these aspects sorted way, way before I start the project myself.
Here is such an example, a set of cannons and a 17th Century brick stove/fire hearth, that were sent to me last night and printed overnight, for the very first check of parts – all went together pretty well, I think.

Wow, yet another wonderfully executed model, Duchess looks fantastic – Love the simple colour scheme and the planking is exceptional! Very well done!

Second Surprise prototype starting to take shape - again, MDF for beams, as this will be discarded once I have all the info I need from this hull...

4 minutes ago, uss frolick said:

So your kit could be used to make La Tourterelle (the turtledove)?

I guess so, with a little tweaking (deck arrangements slightly different)

16 minutes ago, knightyo said:

Am I reading this correctly that in NOT creating the kit based upon the ship that was used in the movie, that the kit you are creating matches more closely the ship depicted in the books?  If that's the case, I think most of the interested modelers would prefer your version anyway.

 

Alan

Yes, the books, not the movie. If you wanted a Surprise based off the movie, then Sphinx would be a better starting point, as they were designed for the same amount of guns and thus very similar dimensions.

Here is the real difference in size between the film version and the real version, the latter being the one above:

(The main wale lines for Surprise are erroneous, and will not be on the actual model, being French)

I have had quite a few enquiries regarding Surprise, asking if it is the film version.

No - it is NOT the film version. It is being developed using the original Admiralty plans of Surprise (Unité of 1794, captured 1796) and he sister, the French Sixth Rate frigate Tourterelle (1794) 

If I were to develop Surprise as per the film, Master and Commander, the hull would be almost 20% smaller, being more Sphinx size, it would be around 18 foot shorter along the gun deck. This is because the film Surprise is that of a replica of a Seaford Class 20 gun ship of the 1750's, somewhat smaller than the actual HMS Surprise - and by the tail end of the 1790's, Surprise was considered very small for a frigate (hence why some refer to her and her sister as corvettes rather than frigates).

Simply stunning!

I had my new laser machine delivered and set up yesterday, a few teething problems, but to be sorted. I now have 2 large machines, with the new one picked specifically for the larger kits I have in mind in the future. This is by far the largest investment yet.

Damn, I need more space....

Pics are a little too bright, shutter doors were open and sun was shining in!

8 minutes ago, Tossedman said:

I love watching a laser cut – and I use one here often. How much bigger or faster or more powerful will your new laser be?

 

Cheers,

 

Todd

Working area not much bigger, 1016 X 610mm compared to the 960 x 610mm of my current machine. However, that extra length does mean I can put 12 x 100x500mm sheets on the bed, rather than 10 sheets, plus I won't have to cut off 50mm off the ends of my larger (1000mm long) sheets to get them to fit.

Current machine is an 80 Watt Sealed CO2 Laser, whereas the new one is 100 Watt (my first one, which is being part exchanged for the new one, is only a 40 Watt and a 635 x 458mm work area, so no good for Indy or Surprise, but got me started and it did cut the first few kits fine, if a little slow...)

Here is my main laser machine cutting a new batch of Sphinx 1mm pear, almost 2 weeks for all parts, but almost all done, so plenty in stock. Laser to be joined by its bigger brother on Thursday!

Fantastic work

7 hours ago, knightyo said:

I won't ever be able to finish the models I already have, but this is mighty tempting.  I have to ask..  Have you thought about having Aubrey/Maturin figures as an option as well?  I'd imagine just about everyone who has read the novels would buy them, especially if they were molded playing their respective instruments. 

 

Alan

I am sure I have already answered this a few posts ago.

I have commissioned 3 figures (along with 2 figureheads). 2 figures being Aubrey and Maturin playing their instruments, and another figure with Aubrey in standing pose. Not cheap to commission, but I always had this in mind for Surprise and think they would be cool to add. These are being worked on right now.

I know some will ask for more, like Killick bumbling into the cabin with a tray of food, but the ones I am having done are expensive, so perhaps something to add at a later date.

I wouldn't worry about that slight scalloping, once the first planking is complete, you will need to sand the whole hull, which will smooth out the worst of it. What I see in your pics is quite normal.

She looks fantastic, Bob, and I love the figures, they give the model 'Life'!

10 hours ago, wvdhee said:

Stunning! Put me down for one 😍

It's a very Dutch thing to ask, but money wise will it be like Indy?

I am hoping to have this a couple of hundred Pounds cheaper than Indy. A new box will be needed, a little smaller than Indy, at around 850mm length (largest laser cut sheets will be 800mm)

OK, for the main pumps, I cannot run away from the fact that the real thing had 6 hand pumps, 3 per side of the Main Mast. This fact is even mentioned in one of the books I am using for reference. As with the Indy and her hand pumps, I cannot ignore this, so this is what my Surprise shall have as standard. However, I shall try (as in remember) to include an alternatve chain pump set in the kit, to give the modeller the choice.

For the main armament, however, I will include as standard 24 x 9-Pounder carriage guns, and offer the 32-Pounder carronades as an optional extra (cannot include both in the kit, as the price would be higher)

But, early days yet, still a lot to do...

1 minute ago, brunnels said:

One of the first things I noticed, I really like the new design.  Do you know what ships boats will come with the kit yet?  Also do you plan on using photo etch or 3d print for the toasted cheese?

Yes, they will all be 3-d printed hulled boats, cutters, launch and pinnace.

Not sure about the toasted cheese...

Here is the work being done on the figurehead, another will be included, so there'll be a choice..

Most of the parts are just MDF for this first build, as I know this is just to test what I have already done, and a few things will be tweaked, and the hull then thrown away..

There are scale deck beams for both the gun deck and upper deck, which will be in 4mm thick pear for the kit. There will be a little detail on the lower deck (although you will not be able to really see it)

This will be my first design that does away completely with a ply sub deck. With scale spaced beams, a sub deck isn't really needed, so a 'Floating' laser engraved deck will be included (Or you can discard the supplied deck and plank as you like...)

I have also designed the bow so that the gun deck isn't cut off by the forward most bulkheads, as is usually the case, but goes all the way forward. (Including the bow chaser/bridle port being framed) . Am yet to see how well this works out...

Overall length will be around 1176mm including the bowsprit and mizzen boom.

Oh, and I have my new laser machine arrive a week today!

Awful quality pics, but these show the very first assembly of Surprise - No glue, all dry fitted.