HMS Kingfisher 1770 by Remcohe - 1/48 - English 14-Gun Sloop - POF

[Timothy Wood]

Fantastic workmanship....  It's a joy to watch your build!

Edited December 11, 2013 by Timothy Wood

[Remcohe]

Thanks, Daniel, Martin, Albert & Tim

 

Onwards to the waterway, it's typical shape is hard to see in the pictures. 

 

In hindsight it was better to work front to back, now I had a hard time to fit the forward portion of the waterway between the closing part at the stem. btw this part looks a lot like a B-2 stealth bomber, would Northrop have peeked at the 18th century ship design before they drafted this 20th century machine 

 

Using a compass to copy the shape of the waterway to the first plank wasn't possible. The compass was to big, so a simple washer did the trick 

 

 

Remco

Edited April 6, 2014 by Remco

[harvey1847]

What a beautifully simple idea! That pic, the one about the washer, goes to my "research folder"...

 

daniel.

[Wishmaster]

Great and beautiful model and top skills. I wish that option "like" is somehow unlimited so I can like many times most of pics of this beautiful model Real enjoy

[druxey]

A washer! Brilliant and simple. Terrific idea, Remco.

[WackoWolf]

A washer, now that brings back memories. When I was a young kid my Father was making some fancy shelf's and stuff for my Mother to put her things on in the family room, he made it to go up and around the big window. The thing is that he use a sugar cup cover, he cut everything with a "Jig Saw" (hand held scroll saw) and when I saw the washer I though of that right away. People will be surprise at the things that we see all the time and what they can be use for besides what they were made for. She is looking Beautiful Danny. Keep the pictures coming.

[Remcohe]

Thanks, funny how problems create new idea's.

 

I laid just  one strake of the deck planking and wil only add partials to support the bulkheads for the cabins. I'll try to keep as much view to the hold as possible.

 

The caulking is very thin paper blackened with a sharpy.

 

 

 

Added some of the furniture just for fun and to see how things start to look 'dressed up'  it will be pretty crowded once the bulkheads are in

 

 

Remco

 

 

Edited April 6, 2014 by Remco

[Martin W]

Those are great shots from above, showing all the fabulous detail of the woodcraft.  Bravo!

 

Martin

[druxey]

Nice work, Remco. Yes, every inch of space was well used in these small ships.

[texxn5]

Hi Remco, I can't believe I'm just now getting around to finding your log.  Piet has often talked about you and for some reason I never got here.   Facinating work.  I have really enjoyed seeing how you make each piece of this.  Great mill and lathe work and attention to detail....very inspiring...

[mati]

Remco your model is real masterpiece!
So good to see such a sterile work!
No simplification that's what I like!

Can you tell me which wood you used for deck planks?
If you have link 'll be great...

 

Best regards,

Matt

[Remcohe]

Thanks Martin, Druxey, John, Matt and everybody who 'liked'

 

Matt I use Holly for the deck planking, I ordered it from Hobbymill  Jeff there makes wonderful  sheets and strips for modeling.

 

For now no pictures, but:

 

Merry Christmas and a wonderful 2014 to all of you here @MSW

 

Remco

[Jeronimo]

Hi Remco.

Excellent and fantastic work.

 

Karl                  

[SJSoane]

 

HI Remco,

 

Looking great. I have tried unsuccessfully to find a solution to scribing in tight quarters that your washer does perfectly. That is definitely going into my toolbox!

 

Best wishes,

 

Mark

[Jim Lad]

Just catching up, Remco.  I've tucked that washer idea away for future use.

 

John

[Remcohe]

Thanks Karl.

 

Mark, John, glad to have given you a nice idea back, I got lots from your log.

 

So not a progress picture but a question.

 

While studying the deck plans to prepare my lower deck layout I noticed something that's puzzling me. All of the Swann models I've seen have the galley on the upper deck but my drawings from the Kingfisher suggest the stove is on the lower deck. Could this be right? It could fit between the bulkhead of the boatswains strore room and the riding bitts. Allthough the U shaped object drawn in, is smaller than a galley stove

 

 

 

On the upper deck there is a notation for the chimney and something I cannot make out

 

 

 

The square part aft of the chimney location looks like the layout of a coaming for a grating

 

Remco

 

 

[Jim Lad]

Remco,

 

There's certainly no doubt about the two labels 'Galley' and 'Chimney', so that would seem clear.

 

I can't quite make out the writing on the other opening, but it does look rather like a coaming.

 

I've tried to enhance the contrast two of your pictures but I still can't make out the writing - perhaps you'll have better luck.

 

 

John

[rlb]

Remco,

 

Interesting!  Could that possibly say "Steam Funnel"? on the deck right above the galley?   Since this is on a lower deck than usual, maybe there was some apparatus (besides just a hatch grating) to disperse cooking steam as well as, and separate from, the chimney which took care of combustion gases?

 

My other observation is that I believe the typical "Brodie" stove needed access all around.   That makes me wonder what the U shaped object is, which is backed up to a bulkhead.  And what is the object on the deck directly above it.

 

Cheers,

Ron

Edited January 3, 2014 by rlb

[garyshipwright]

Hi Remco.

I may have a answer for you. According to David Lyon's book The Sailing Navy List, Kingfisher was built in 1770 which and was  burnt in 1778. My  reason for bringing up the 1778 date is the English Navy didn't start using the Brodie stove untill 1781, when the enter into a contract to buy them.  She probably had the fire heath of the old type. From looking in Goodwin's book, The Sailing Man of War, there is a  fire hearth  of 1770, on page 161. From looking at it, one would not need to get all the way around it. Hope this is of some help sir. Ron I do believe that the u shape is were the fire heath it self set sir, and the one grate aft of the Chimney was a steam grate as you said, I do believe. The big pot of the fire hearth probably sat right below it.  

 Gary

Edited January 3, 2014 by garyshipwright

[druxey]

Fire hearth is what occurred to me also, seeing the 'U' shaped layout. As this was an extremely heavy item with its brickwork, etc, it makes sense that it would be placed lower in the ship that the conventional Brodie style stove. I concur with Gary. Also, the steam funnel would be necessary to vent the area in addition to the hearth's flue for smoke.

[Remcohe]

Jim, thanks for enhancing the picture, Ron's right, it say's steam funnel. When I look at my original NMM copy I can see it now. 

Gary thanks for pointing me to your references. It's clear the Kingfisher could not have a real Brodie stove. Although when I did more research I found that iron fire hearths "had become fairly general in 1757" (Lavery, The Arming and Fitting of English Ships of War 1600-1815 p197) so a Brodie style stove was used in the era KF was designed and build. More sources show a lot of Brodie style stoves, but Mr Alexander Brodie was so clever to apply for a patent  and become exclusive supplier for almost 30 years until Lamb & Nicholson took over. 

 

Lavery also shows a brick hearth of 1741 with a shape exactly the same as the U shape on my plan. 

 

 

So interesting that while iron stoves were a big improvement over brick hearths the NMM plan still has the more 'obsolete' on it. How it was eventually build on the Kingfisher we will probably never know. But nice to do a little research on the topic. 

 

Now back to how I will proceed. Because there are more differences from the actual KF and the model I'm building. A few years back (well into the build) when I got my NMM plans I noticed that KF has an additional gun port on each side. The 'kit' where my build started from omitted this. Also, and I noticed this studying the deck plan this week, the lower deck is in two sections, you can see this on one of the previous pictures. The aft part is 12" higher.  So apart from the boxing around the hawseholes my ship is anything but the Kingfisher.

 

Time to rename her? But to what....

 

Remco

Edited January 4, 2014 by Remco

[garyshipwright]

Hi Remco.  

 

Sorry about that sir, seems that I stopped after I read about when the Brodie came in to the English Navy. There I went again and not looking in these other books. for infomation. For the last couple of days I have been researching Alfreds stove and how to make all the parts and pieces that go in to making one. Figure that I need some practice on my metal work, so why not make a Brodie stove for Alfred. Have been looking in HMS Victory by Bugler on help with this and after you mention Lavery's book, I find all kinds of Dimensions for the stove, so I have to thank you for pointing this out to me.  Do look forward to seeing more on your build, but first I have to go get some more popcorn.   

 

Gary

[amateur]

Hi Remco,

 

Just leave it at Kingfisher. There is nothing else to rename it to.

And once, in the distant future, you will build a new one, avoinding all the mistakes and errors you made in this one, (presumably finding new ones along the route )

 

btw are you sure on the 12" difference? If so, why didn't no one observe it before?

 

Jan

[SJSoane]

 

Hi Remco,

 

Funny thing about research. You don't often see things unless you are explicitly looking for them, and sometimes you see them but they don't yet make sense. Even after studying drawings for some time before a build, we don't really understand some of it until we start building. So unless we are willing to go back and tear out everything that we now understand differently, our models will always be a little out of sync with our current understanding. This is especially true with the more schematic admiralty drawings that you and I are working from, where not much detail is shown. I have sometimes fantasized about building the Bellona again, only closer to my current understanding. But I quickly put those thoughts aside. Only you and the original shipwright will know for sure where your outstanding model deviates from the original.

 

best wishes,

 

Mark

[Remcohe]

Glad to be of help Gary, the table with the stove's dimensions is quite comprehensive.

Jan, I added a picture of the plan, in the middle you'll see two beams just above each other.

 

 

Thanks Mark, you're so right. I guess the positive side of our learning is that now we know how it should be, it's just that the model is one version behind our current understanding. I guess the only way to overcome our agony is to build less time-consuming projects like ship's boats. Then making a second one is just a matter of weeks.

 

Remco

[druxey]

It looks as if the lower deck was lowered forward to accommodate the galley. The notation on the drawing suggests that draught is very close to the 'as built' for Swan and Kingfisher. Remember that these two ships were the leading ones of this class, so the earlier type of galley would make sense here. It's a nice variation on the Swan theme - or is that the swan-song?

[Remcohe]

Well Druxey let's see what song this Swan is going to sing over the stove.... I might make an early brick type galley to see how it looks and decide then.

 

Between looking at stoves, hearths and all that comes with that (does give an appetite seeing those big grill's...) I dry fitted most of the upper deck beams so now I can sart working on the bulkheads on the lower deck. 

 

 

 

 

Remco

[druxey]

Not that I wish to influence you in any way, Remco, but a) a brick hearth would look really interesting and different and  I'm sure you could make a superb one. (He walks away, whistling nonchalantly…)

Edited January 4, 2014 by druxey

[garyshipwright]

You know druxey, have to agree with you a 100%. If any one can do a outstanding job on making one it would be Remco and it would be one of a kind that's for sure. Looking forward to it. Gary

[Trussben]

And Druxey drops the challenge on Remco again, this should be great to watch!!