Prinz Eugen 1942 by CDW - FINISHED - Trumpeter - 1:700 Scale - PLASTIC

[CDW]

31 minutes ago, Old Collingwood said:

Whats your work ethic  with the painting  -  assemble the sub assmblies  including the PE, then  spray primer then colour  then if  you are fitting them the wood decks?    just getting a flow for when I start my Hood.

 

OC.

First thing I do is wash the plastic and photo etch parts in a mild solution of water and dish washing liquid. Spray the photo etch parts with a metal primer.

 

 

Modify the plastic parts as required then apply the photo etch. Dry fit the superstructure components for painting. After painting, disassemble then add the wood deck stickers.

[Old Collingwood]

24 minutes ago, CDW said:

First thing I do is wash the plastic and photo etch parts in a mild solution of water and dish washing liquid. Spray the photo etch parts with a metal primer.

 

 

Modify the plastic parts as required then apply the photo etch. Dry fit the superstructure components for painting. After painting, disassemble then add the wood deck stickers.

Does the metal primer stay put  when you start bending it into shape, or does it crack?    I have never used it.

 

OC.

[CDW]

Just now, Old Collingwood said:

Does the metal primer stay put  when you start bending it into shape, or does it crack?    I have never used it.

 

OC.

I have not found any primer or paint that does not crack when bending the photo etch. If you do, let me know. I just touch up as needed with a brush after it's all done.

[Old Collingwood]

15 minutes ago, CDW said:

I have not found any primer or paint that does not crack when bending the photo etch. If you do, let me know. I just touch up as needed with a brush after it's all done.

Thats why I wonder if its best to attach it first  before priming and painting.

 

OC.

[CDW]

Just now, Old Collingwood said:

Thats why I wonder if its best to attach it first  before priming and painting.

 

OC.

There is no one good answer to that question. Sometimes it's best to prime and paint first. Other times, it's best to paint in place. However, that primer I showed you is the least prone to crack of anything else I have used. But it's not crack-proof. You're going to find that sometimes painting after it's all bent and assembled is not practical for a number of reasons. 

As an example...the outer railings I will paint first before installing on the model. Why? Because I will have already placed the wood deck and the rest of the model will be painted before installing those railings. If I tried to paint them after installing, I would get paint in places where I don't want paint to be.

[Landlubber Mike]

My PE prep process is slightly different.  I usually soak the frets in water with dish soap, though sometimes I've forgotten and I'm not sure I've seen any different results.  I've had success using Mr. Surfacer and Vallejo primers in the past, but Vallejo can flake off with masking which can be annoying.  I did try that Mr. Metal Primer once, but forget what I was using it on.

 

For most subassemblies, I'll first attach the PE and then prime and paint.  I figure that the primer can help fill in minor gaps left from the PE not fully sitting on the plastic, PE folds that aren't perfect, etc.  For things like railings, I've primed and painted right on the fret and then attached it to the model.  Since railings are just about the last thing to go on, it's just easier that way and like Craig said, you don't want to paint the railings if you have a wood or linoleum deck or other colors on the model that differ from the railings color.  And again like Craig said, you can touch up any parts where the brass shows, glue spots, etc.

 

I was watching someone on YouTube yesterday who was working with PE on a ship model.  He prepped the PE fret by rubbing it with an Infini 400 sanding stick.  I think the idea is that primer has more surface area to stick to, and maybe to remove and residue from the PE process.  But like I said, I haven't really had issues painting primer directly to PE.  I'd also be a little nervous using a sanding stick on 1/700 PE frets or PE frets in general with very fine details as I'd be worried that the stick would catch some of the free floating details and ruin the part.  But, the guy yesterday didn't seem to have that problem.

Edited September 21, 2021 by Landlubber Mike

[CDW]

9 minutes ago, Landlubber Mike said:

I'd also be a little nervous using a sanding stick on 1/700 PE frets or PE frets in general with very fine details as I'd be worried that the stick would catch some of the free floating details and ruin the part.  But, the guy yesterday didn't seem to have that problem.

The Flyhawk photo etch is so thin, trying to sand it would end in disaster. It literally breaks apart sometimes before it’s bent. I think they need to go a gauge higher on their brass thickness. Way too thin. Makes it almost impossible for some modelers. I have lost parts right off the frets without ever cutting them.

 

[Landlubber Mike]

I saw that in my FiveStar set for the 1/700 destroyer I built.  Hair-thin PE that bends from just breathing on it.

[king derelict]

2 hours ago, CDW said:

The Flyhawk photo etch is so thin, trying to sand it would end in disaster. It literally breaks apart sometimes before it’s bent. I think they need to go a gauge higher on their brass thickness. Way too thin. Makes it almost impossible for some modelers. I have lost parts right off the frets without ever cutting them.

 

Yep, no second chances of you find you bent the part in the wrong direction. Just straightening it is often enough to break it. Likewise I've had parts break in the fret.

Alan

[mikegr]

14 hours ago, Old Collingwood said:

Does the metal primer stay put  when you start bending it into shape, or does it crack?    I have never used it.

 

OC.

Like I have said in previous thread the most durable and sticky primer for shiny metal parts is epoxy primer like those used in car industry. I always prime my PE parts them work with them with no issues.

[Old Collingwood]

16 hours ago, CDW said:

There is no one good answer to that question. Sometimes it's best to prime and paint first. Other times, it's best to paint in place. However, that primer I showed you is the least prone to crack of anything else I have used. But it's not crack-proof. You're going to find that sometimes painting after it's all bent and assembled is not practical for a number of reasons. 

As an example...the outer railings I will paint first before installing on the model. Why? Because I will have already placed the wood deck and the rest of the model will be painted before installing those railings. If I tried to paint them after installing, I would get paint in places where I don't want paint to be.

Thank you for explaining that Craig,   I guess  for some sub assemblies where there is a uniform colour  - assembling them priming/painting would be ok,  but I can see the need to prime/paint railings first before attaching  especially if a wood deck has gone down  or other areas with different colours/shades of pant.

 

OC.

[king derelict]

1 hour ago, Old Collingwood said:

Thank you for explaining that Craig,   I guess  for some sub assemblies where there is a uniform colour  - assembling them priming/painting would be ok,  but I can see the need to prime/paint railings first before attaching  especially if a wood deck has gone down  or other areas with different colours/shades of pant.

 

OC.

I broadly follow Craig. I paint railings, ships boats and rafts, and gun turrets off the model. I suspect other than these which are fairly fixed in my process I think it depends on the model, the access when installed and the ability to paint without getting overspray where you don't want it. 

Alan

[RogerF]

On 9/21/2021 at 4:36 AM, CDW said:

Add some masts, radar arrays, build and detail some boats, then will be ready to do some painting.

 

In the time you've taken to do all this PE work, I've managed to drill two holes in the hull of my Hood and it's stand!

[RogerF]

On 9/21/2021 at 7:16 AM, CDW said:

There is no one good answer to that question. Sometimes it's best to prime and paint first. Other times, it's best to paint in place. However, that primer I showed you is the least prone to crack of anything else I have used. But it's not crack-proof. You're going to find that sometimes painting after it's all bent and assembled is not practical for a number of reasons. 

As an example...the outer railings I will paint first before installing on the model. Why? Because I will have already placed the wood deck and the rest of the model will be painted before installing those railings. If I tried to paint them after installing, I would get paint in places where I don't want paint to be.

 

Indeed. With the Hood, the upper deck is in one piece and has 4 different colours/surfaces. There is the linoleum -deck brown, the steel-deck grey (which I believe is different to 507A), the superstructure grey (Admiralty 507A) and then a section of wood deck, all on the one part. Even with the full masking set I will need to be very careful as to what sequence I adopt for painting and wood deck fitting.

[CDW]

While building these 1:700 scale ship models, you need good precision tweezers to hold small parts. I had accidentally dropped mine several times and damaged the points. I couldn’t recall where I had bought the damaged set and tried several times to buy replacements, but struck out on finding a suitable pair. The photo of these two sets came from Amazon and are good replacements for the ones I damaged. Of the two, the ones labeled TS-12 are the most comfortable to hold and use in my opinion. Best part is, they’re only $5 each from Amazon with free Prime shipping.

 

[Landlubber Mike]

They aren’t cheap, but after trying out many tweezers, I tried Dumont tweezers which are very good.  I believe I first heard about them when reading a book on miniature ship model building.

 

Here is a picture of the tips of two that I use the most.  Very sharp points!

 

Edited September 22, 2021 by Landlubber Mike

[king derelict]

2 hours ago, CDW said:

While building these 1:700 scale ship models, you need good precision tweezers to hold small parts. I had accidentally dropped mine several times and damaged the points. I couldn’t recall where I had bought the damaged set and tried several times to buy replacements, but struck out on finding a suitable pair. The photo of these two sets came from Amazon and are good replacements for the ones I damaged. Of the two, the ones labeled TS-12 are the most comfortable to hold and use in my opinion. Best part is, they’re only $5 each from Amazon with free Prime shipping.

 

Whenever I drop mine they always land points down - in my leg or on the tile floor. I think the points are getting beyond filing and straightening so these might be a good option.

Thanks

Alan

[CDW]

29 minutes ago, king derelict said:

Whenever I drop mine they always land points down - in my leg or on the tile floor. I think the points are getting beyond filing and straightening so these might be a good option.

Thanks

Alan

That’s what happened to mine. Dropped, bent, and filed them down too many times. For 5.99, buy a few. 😀

They will eventually be used and needed.

[CDW]

More added then another dry fit. Getting ever closer to paint. Slow but sure.

 

[Old Collingwood]

Excellent!    needs no other words Craig.

 

OC.

[CDW]

Just now, Old Collingwood said:

Excellent!    needs no other words Craig.

 

OC.

Thanks OC. But it does need more photo etch. I'm not even half-way through all the photo etch that came with the update set. 

[Old Collingwood]

46 minutes ago, CDW said:

Thanks OC. But it does need more photo etch. I'm not even half-way through all the photo etch that came with the update set. 

Its looking Stunning already  even at this stage mate.

 

OC.

[mikegr]

On 9/23/2021 at 1:50 AM, Landlubber Mike said:

They aren’t cheap, but after trying out many tweezers, I tried Dumont tweezers which are very good.  I believe I first heard about them when reading a book on miniature ship model building.

 

Here is a picture of the tips of two that I use the most.  Very sharp points!

 

I got a set used for micro electronic repairs.

I also got a few of cheaper ones which I sharpened with dremel tool and turned equally good to the pro set

Frequently sharpening of twizzers, pliers and other tools  removes glue, paint and keeps them very effective no matter how they cost.

[CDW]

Laid some paint on the superstructure then a little post shading for modulation. Will disassemble the superstructure pieces then work next on the wood deck pieces, before final assembly of the deck component parts. There are additional sections of railing that will go down after the decks are completed.

 

[Old Collingwood]

24 minutes ago, CDW said:

Laid some paint on the superstructure then a little post shading for modulation. Will disassemble the superstructure pieces then work next on the wood deck pieces, before final assembly of the deck component parts. There are additional sections of railing that will go down after the decks are completed.

 

Looking good Craig   - always looks better with some colour down.

 

OC.

[CDW]

30 minutes ago, Old Collingwood said:

Looking good Craig   - always looks better with some colour down.

 

OC.

Thanks OC

I reshot the photos inside my white photo box. Didn’t like the way they came out inside the black box.

 

[Old Collingwood]

That looks better  - the camera was over exposing   in the first shots.

 

OC.

[Old Collingwood]

Taking in all the details of your's  Alans  and Rogers builds  (even though I am not building - doesn't stop the grey matter from turning)

Kind of formulating a build plan for my Hood, will explain on my build as I dont want to de-rail you  build Craig.

 

OC.

[CDW]

This ship has more tiny wood deck pieces than any other model I have built to date, but it all comes together in the end in a way that’s visually pleasing.

I knew it would probably happen, but managed to inadvertently crush a few pieces of railing here and there while disassembling and reassembling the superstructure pieces. Straightened them as best I could.

 

 

 

[lmagna]

Nice progress Craig. I bet that you are happy to finally get the main superstructure painted and attached. Can't see anything hanging or bent in your pictures so it all must have turned out OK.

 

The way they established the plank pattern on the main deck looks a little odd, at least to me. Hopefully it won't be as pronounced when you add the remaining superstructure and other decks.