1880's Floating Steam Donkey Pile Driver by Keith Black - FINISHED - 1:120 Scale

[Glen McGuire]

18 minutes ago, Keith Black said:

Roof treatment. I can't decide what to do, paint the wood black with a little grey mixed in or put down masking tape and paint in the same manner? At this scale i don't know that tape would look right??

There are probably several different things you can do with that roof.  Do you have a picture of what you want it to look like?

[Keith Black]

Glen, the two photos below best show the roof look I'm trying to achieve.  

 

 

 

 

[Glen McGuire]

2 hours ago, Keith Black said:

the two photos below best show the roof look I'm trying to achieve.  

The surface of those roofs look pretty smooth to me.  I'd be inclined to do your first idea - paint the wood with a black/gray mixture.

[wefalck]

Some people use wet-n-dry sanding paper of an appropriate grade and paint it a dark grey to resemble tar-paper.

[clearway]

looks good though Keith- you could have probably built a full size shed in the same time😉

 

Keith

[Cathead]

As much as I like using masking tape to simulate tarpaper roofs, I think I agree that it'd be out of scale for this project. Wefalck might be right about trying a very fine-grained sandpaper. Another possibility would be tissue of some kind, which is especially thin but will help hide any wood grain. 

 

The shed looks wonderful!

[Keith Black]

 Thank you to everyone for the likes and for following along. 

 

 Keith, thank you for the kind comment and once maybe, long ago and far away.  

 

Glen, Eberhard, and Eric thank you so much for your input regarding roofing material. 

 

I really liked the idea of using sandpaper and played around some last night, thank you for tip, Eberhard. 

 

Since I'm trying to shoehorn this project into the early 1880's I'm trying to stay true to the roofing systems of that time period. Asphalt shingles were't invented till 1901 so they're out of the equation. Asphalt sheeting at the time of the 1880's was seen a temporary.  The most common roofing for a project of this type at the time was wood shingles with corrugated roofing coming in second. 

 

I've placed an order with Wild West Models (see the below link) for their wood shingles and corrugated sheeting. Both are made of paper which is a real selling point as I think ridged 3d printed roofing would be harder to install. It may take a week or two before this order arrives so I'll finish everything on the shed except the roof and hanging the doors. 

 

https://www.wildwestmodels.com/index.html

[mbp521]

2 hours ago, Keith Black said:

The most common roofing for a project of this type at the time was wood shingles with corrugated roofing coming in second.

I’m thinking the corrugated roofing might just set it off perfectly. A little silver and rust patina would look great. 
 

-Brian

[Keith Black]

1 hour ago, mbp521 said:

I’m thinking the corrugated roofing might just set it off perfectly. A little silver and rust patina would look great.

 Brian, because this represents a floating pile driver about a year old I think a rust patina would be too much. I'll just have to be patient and see what I get in that box of chocolates from Wild West. I'm currently leaning toward the shake roof as it was the more common but we'll see. 

 

 While waiting for that order to get here I have plenty to do like paint figures, make rope coils, and make other props that go on the barge and shed.  

[Retired guy]

Way to go on the roof Keith, just wondering if you should put a metal plate on roof where the smoke stack goes through, one wouldn't what a hot pipe near wood roof 🤔

 

Regards

Richard 

[Keith Black]

3 hours ago, Retired guy said:

Way to go on the roof Keith, just wondering if you should put a metal plate on roof where the smoke stack goes through, one wouldn't what a hot pipe near wood roof 🤔

 Thank you, Richard. i'll add flashing after the roofing material is added.

 

 Back in the day everyone who had a shake or thatched roof ran the risk of roof fires as everyone burned wood or coal and had a chimney of some sort. Sure there were roof fires but not to the extent one would think. When I lived in Washington state we used wood to heat, cook, and make hot water. We had runaway chimney fires if I didn't use Red Devil creosote treatment on a regular basis. Back in the day it was chimney sweeps that kept the creosote levels down. It amazes me there weren't more roof fires in early times when wood and coal was used extensively.

[Retired guy]

2 hours ago, Keith Black said:

 Thank you, Richard. i'll add flashing after the roofing material is added.

 

 Back in the day everyone who had a shake or thatched roof ran the risk of roof fires as everyone burned wood or coal and had a chimney of some sort. Sure there were roof fires but not to the extent one would think. When I lived in Washington state we used wood to heat, cook, and make hot water. We had runaway chimney fires if I didn't use Red Devil creosote treatment on a regular basis. Back in the day it was chimney sweeps that kept the creosote levels down. It amazes me there weren't more roof fires in early times when wood and coal was used extensively.

 

I remember back in the day in England in our house close to Poole Dorset we had fire places to heat all the rooms, and in the kitchen we had the stove which was always burning with wood and coke (the gay colour) it was the cheapest. My chore was to cut the wood into kindling and bring up the coke and make the fires up. The stove in the kitchen heated up the water tank.

Those were the days eh.

 

Regards

Richard

  

[clearway]

i still have two open coal fires in the house and have the brush and screw together rods to sweep the chimneys + a woodburning stove in my shepherds hut!

On the railway brake vans (railroad cabooses for across the pond) they had a casting to guide the pipe through the roof to keep it away from the wood and canvas.

 

Keith

[Canute]

Keith, use the wrapping paper you get inside a present box. Pretty thin and smooth. Paint it on with a charcoal gray paint. No glue, that will dry out and the paper will separate when that happens. Did that once and it did separate. I did do some caboose/vans back in the day with Kleenex tissues and Floquil weathered black. They were good, but the weave in the tissue was too coarse for HO scale canvas.

[Cathead]

On 9/29/2024 at 11:38 AM, Keith Black said:

because this represents a floating pile driver about a year old I think a rust patina would be too much

Just food for thought, I'd think that even just a year in a semi-salty environment would be quite enough to start the rust going. Heck, I've mistakenly left hatchets out in the rain for a night and the rust starts the next day. But your shingle idea will look nice too. I've used paper shingle sets on model railroad buildings to very good effect.

[KeithAug]

On 10/5/2024 at 4:34 AM, Retired guy said:

I remember back in the day in England in our house close to Poole Dorset we had fire places to heat all the rooms,

In Yorkshire we had a fire place in every room but we could only afford to ignite one. I remember spending many a happy hour pushing the ice round the inside of my bedroom window in winter. 

I can hear you all now "Window! Window! you were lucky to have windows, we only had oil soaked rags covering the holes in our walls. Oil soaked rags! Oil soaked rags! You were lucky we sealed the openings in our walls with ................................. etc, etc.

Great progress on the wonky donkey Keith. Excellent brushwork.

[Keith Black]

 Thank you to everyone for the likes and for following along.

 

On 10/4/2024 at 11:34 PM, Retired guy said:

I remember back in the day in England in our house close to Poole Dorset we had fire places to heat all the rooms, and in the kitchen we had the stove which was always burning with wood and coke (the gay colour) it was the cheapest. My chore was to cut the wood into kindling and bring up the coke and make the fires up. The stove in the kitchen heated up the water tank.

Those were the days eh.

 Richard, time makes those memories more romantic than they actually were. Heating with an alternate fuel source requires a commitment that only youth can sustain. 

 

On 10/5/2024 at 12:59 PM, clearway said:

i still have two open coal fires in the house and have the brush and screw together rods to sweep the chimneys + a woodburning stove in my shepherds hut!

On the railway brake vans (railroad cabooses for across the pond) they had a casting to guide the pipe through the roof to keep it away from the wood and canvas.

 Keith, the thing I disliked about using coal is not being able to bank a fire at night due to the possibility of carbon monoxide poisoning. The plan is to replicate that very thing for the boiler stack. 

 

On 10/5/2024 at 2:06 PM, Canute said:

Keith, use the wrapping paper you get inside a present box. Pretty thin and smooth. Paint it on with a charcoal gray paint. No glue, that will dry out and the paper will separate when that happens. Did that once and it did separate. I did do some caboose/vans back in the day with Kleenex tissues and Floquil weathered black. They were good, but the weave in the tissue was too coarse for HO scale canvas.

 Thank you, Ken. I plan on using a tiny strip of masking tape to replicate the boiler stack flashing. 

 

6 hours ago, Cathead said:

Just food for thought, I'd think that even just a year in a semi-salty environment would be quite enough to start the rust going. Heck, I've mistakenly left hatchets out in the rain for a night and the rust starts the next day. But your shingle idea will look nice too. I've used paper shingle sets on model railroad buildings to very good effect.

 Eric, good thought. If and when I ever get the Wild West order I'll do test with both products and post for everyone's response. 

 

2 hours ago, KeithAug said:

In Yorkshire we had a fire place in every room but we could only afford to ignite one. I remember spending many a happy hour pushing the ice round the inside of my bedroom window in winter. 

I can hear you all now "Window! Window! you were lucky to have windows, we only had oil soaked rags covering the holes in our walls. Oil soaked rags! Oil soaked rags! You were lucky we sealed the openings in our walls with ................................. etc, etc.

Great progress on the wonky donkey Keith. Excellent brushwork.

 Thank you, Keith. It's amazing what we accepted in our youth as being normal that in todays world be regarded as being something only experienced in a third world country. The wealth of our nations has made us a very soft people. God forbid that overnight we would have to regress back 70 years in time. Can you imagine? 

 

 

It's been a lazy week for myself. I've played around with weathering a bit. For me the key is getting the feel for the right amount of pastel to add to a brush and apply the correct amount to an area before scrubbing it in. I'll not be using a fixing agent so I'll be scrubbing the pastels in with great vigor.

 I added the vertical trim to the shed's first floor but need to wait to have the roofing material added before I can add the tower trim. 

 

 Thank you everyone for your support. 

 

   Keith

[tmj]

8 minutes ago, Keith Black said:

I'll be scrubbing the pastels in with great vigor

I can loan you a frog and save you from all of that vigorous work! 

[Keith Black]

13 minutes ago, tmj said:

I can loan you a frog and save you from all of that vigorous work! 

 Too funny, Tom. A question once asked on an applied mathematics test.........if it takes three thousand whacks with a ten pound sledge hammer to drive an inch thick banana through a two by four, how long will it take a frog jumping up and down in a cup of water to create enough steam to blow a factory whistle? 

[tmj]

16 minutes ago, Keith Black said:

Too funny, Tom. A question once asked on an applied mathematics test.........if it takes three thousand whacks with a ten pound sledge hammer to drive an inch thick banana through a two by four, how long will it take a frog jumping up and down in a cup of water to create enough steam to blow a factory whistle? 

I'm not sure, Keith. I'm still trying to figure out just how many seeds a one-legged grasshopper could effectively kick out of a Carolina dill pickle if old fashioned ice cream had bones? 🫤 

[Keith Black]

1 minute ago, tmj said:

I'm not sure, Keith. I'm still trying to figure out just how many seeds a one-legged grasshopper could effectively kick out of a Carolina dill pickle if old fashioned ice cream had bones?

 Very easy answer. Tom. Only half as many seeds as a two legged grasshopper. 

[mtaylor]

If I remember right from my school days back in the dark ages, the answer to most of those questions would have "strawberries don't have bones.".

[wefalck]

Looking forward to the results of the roofing experiments and the weathering ...

 

Talking about heating: we just came back from a business trip to Italy and found that the apartment had only just above 16°C - the heating in the condominium doesn't come on until mid-October, regardless of conditions 🤨

The funny thing is that southern Europeans seem to be much more tolerant to cold apartments because they are rarely home and outside day-time temperatures are quite tolerable. In Italy heating is not permitted until 1 November, regardless, whether you live in Sicily or around the Alps. My apartment in Bergamo in 1991 didn't have any heating, except for the kitchen 🥶. Likewise, when I was looking for an apartment in Nottingham in January 1987, one was advertised as having 'central heating' - it turned out it had 'central' gas heater in the living room ...

The apartment in Germany, where I first grew up in the 1950s/early 1960s had stove heating and remember my mother firing up the stove first thing in the morning and I also remember pushing ice around the window pane in the childrens' room.

[clearway]

in this weeks twilight zone..........

[clearway]

sorry wefalck was referring to the interesting mathematical conundrums- we must have posted at same time!

[Keith Black]

Thank you to everyone for the kind comments, the likes, and for following along. 

 

 This post contains a lot of photos but very little cast in stone work.

 

 I received my Wild West order a week after placing. I jumped all over the shingles as I was positive that was the look I wanted. But now there's something I don't quite like about the shingles and I'm be danged if I can put my finger on it. One maybe, instead of a half lap of the strips as recommended I went with a three quarter lap because the half lap looked too busy. Now, looking at the completed roof, the three quarter lap doesn't look right. 

 

 Before ripping roofing 1.0 off I'm going to paint the shingles to eliminate one possible reason I'm having doubts about the shingles. I'll take photos of the painted shingles when done. Once the roof is cleared and cleaned up I'm going to put on the metal roofing to see if that satisfies my inner WA. . 

 

 

I finally got a chance to use the pastels. It's safe to say I'm a convert in learning. It's so easy to get heavy handed with pastels, a little goes a long way.

 

 Black is such a light sucking color. Even a single object like a cleat with out highlighting appears as a lump. A little gray sure makes black objects pop. In the  case of the Donkey engine, detail was pretty lost but once a little gray was added..........I've added too much and need to remove some of the gray.

 

Rust on the water tank looks pretty spot on. I also worked the barge deck with pastels but the engine shed needs to get permanently attached before the barge deck can be tackled properly. 

 

Too much!

 

 I'm real happy with the the ash around the firebox. 

 

 Some pastels added to the pile driver. 

 

 

 An overview of the project. A lot of fine and not so fine tuning required but I think I'm making progress. 

 

 

 

 

 Thank you everyone for your support.

 

   Keith

Edited October 11 by Keith Black

[Glen McGuire]

Your work with the pastels is very convincing, Keith.  And yes, a little goes a looong way as I have learned!

[Keith Black]

11 minutes ago, Glen McGuire said:

Your work with the pastels is very convincing, Keith.  And yes, a little goes a looong way as I have learned!

 Thank you, Glen. My difficulty is trying to make the pastels show up at 1:120 scale. The pastels show up much better in a close up photo than in normal viewing.

[Paul Le Wol]

Keith, your work with the pastels is amazing. What a difference they make!

[mbp521]

Holy cow Keith! It’s amazing the amount of realism the pastels bring out. You also have me convinced the shaker roof is the right decision. I think it looks great. However, if you are proceeding with the metal roof I will be anxiously awaiting those results as well. 
 

42 minutes ago, Keith Black said:

Black is such a light sucking color.

This is such a true statement. When I first started painting my Cairo, I chose black for the topside color. I found out real quick that it was not the route to go. After several attempts I found that the dark bluish-gray was perfect. It gave everything the perfect depth and helped highlight certain features. The same holds true with your build. Fantastic work on the weathering!

 

-Brian