Rattlesnake by JPett - Model Shipways - Scale 1/64th - Kit #MS2028

[JPett]

Ahoy Mates

 

Well it's been a while since my last post. After three attempts to construct the gun ports I felt a break was in order. I was not having any fun shipbuilding so I took the month off. Although I am very happy with my progress so far it should be made clear my intention on this build is not to create a perfect model but is, and has always been to just enjoy this hobby and learn.

 

The Gun ports being no exception

 

With that, I will for the benefit "I hope" of others try to explain what I did and learned.

 

As this was a progression there might be some steps touched on in my previous posts/attempts

 

My kit, as some will remember had a few problems with bulkhead alignment right from the start. Unfortunately these issues were not fully corrected as I had thought and revisited me during the gun port installation. I compounded this with my repeated attempts to create a curved line using straight pieces to form the gun port framing. This does not work BTW. The fix for this however was very simple. Soak all the wood for framing the gun ports and just as with planking; form/clamp it to the hull where it is to be used. After forming the wood along the outside, mark and cut it to the needed lengths, then install them between the bulkheads. Forming the wood in this way highlighted stray bulkheads that were not properly aligned similar to using battens while planking. With battens temporarily installed, stray bulkheads created waves in the line of the gunwales and upper deck walls easily seen when viewed from above. I used up all the kit supplied 1/16" by 1/16" wood in earlier attempts, so I switched up to the kit supplied decking material which ended up being much easier to work with. I also found it easier to make the oar ports smaller and then file them to the correct size.

 

I was still not done learning, It seems I created another problem for myself by not following the instructions.  For reasons still unknown I got it in my head that gun ports needed to be square, perfectly square. The plans clearly show this to be untrue. It seems the horizontal sills follow the deck and the vertical ones the bulkheads making gun ports, quadrilaterals on the Ratt. This problem was easily resolved by referencing the big white pieces of paper I use to cover the walls of my work space and repurposing the square gun port jig.

 

Maybe I overthought all of this (Me???) but in my defense I see the gun ports as an important aspect of my build. There needed to be a graceful flow to them that was in step with lines of the hull. The framing was also a surface that would be planked and therefore I felt needed to meet all of those requirements. My first three attempts never did.

Well; its almost water under the bridge now and after a brief hiatus it is now time to move forward. For now please find some pics of my current progress.

 

I am very proud of the window framing but slightly concerned about repeating it on the Starboard side.

Edited September 24, 2013 by JPett

[Trussben]

Glad to see you back at it JP.

 

Ben

[Beef Wellington]

We all seem to be doing some fixes right now - looks like a happy end to this story.  Hard to tell from the photos, but I would definitely agree with you that the gunports are something that has to be 'right' as I suspect that they would be very noticeable.  Its funny how some 'errors' are not really noticeable, yet much smaller ones stick out like a sore thumb.  One thing I'm continuing to learn is to not be afraid of the fix - although I haven't yet attempted anything as ambitious as you.  Well done.

[JSGerson]

I saved myself from committing error by making a cannon mock-up out of card stock to make sure the cannon would poke through the gun port at the proper height at each gun port location. That little test would have spotted your error by noting that the gun point height was changing as you moved the mock-up around.

[augie]

Glad to see you back in the fray.  Nice job on the window.

 

Yes, making sweep ports a little smaller and then using a good file to open and square them up is a good method.

 

Gee whiz ----- that hull planking looks great

[src]

JP,

Great to see you back at it. Ports look good to me.

I started a fresh batch of popcorn and the adult beverages are cooling in the fridge over in the corner.

Sam

[Ferit]

Ahoy JPett, 

Finally you had returned to your build... 

Pleasure to see you again here, in your struggle as Augie said...

The best is the ennemy of the good. Important is do not miss the good while running after the best...

Your decision about making ports as square looks quite right to me...

Thank you really for giving a second chance of following your great build.

[patrickmil]

JP, we're all happy you're making sawdust again. The gunport you have finished looks really good.

[popeye the sailor]

good to see you back at the table....yes, it can be a trial sometimes.   but once you figure it out,  the rest will be a breeze   you've progressed quite nicely........the hull looks good.    I just had a thought.....how are you gauging these gun ports,  if your deck and waterways are not done?

[Martin W]

Ahoy back to you, mate -- good to hear (read) your voice back in the mix.  As always, your struggles are edifying and bring up some valuable details in technique. 

 

As for the standard of "square" on a structure that simply is not square, I think you hit on the solution when you referred to the need for a "graceful flow."  Square is an unobtainable ideal, but graceful flow will always please the eye!

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

[texxn5]

Welcome back, we've missed seeing you progress.....know what you mean about needing a break sometimes....

[md1400cs]

JP,

 

Yes, welcome back, we've missed you (:-)

 

But breaks are good. I know that when I'm working on my build and I'm not really "feeling it"; its time for a break as well in order to get the positive and creative juices flowing again. Then its fun, again, and not a "job".

 

These breaks also allow for not rushing to get through an area, then seeing that the results are below expectations. Your build has always been a delight to watch grow. Yes, you should be proud of it. It is proving to be so excellent ++ A pleasure for the eyes. Your notes are also a great source of learning.

 

Regards,

 

Michael

Edited September 26, 2013 by md1400cs

[sport29652]

As always your dillegence and thoughtfully approach to your build has/is helping us all. Keep up the good work sir !

[JPett]

Ahoy Mates

 

Ben: Thx It was good to take a break but it is better to be back

 

Jason: For me, repairs are just a part of the process. Funny how our eye always goes right there. Must be genetic

 

JS: Welcome aboard. I have followed your log and am very jealous. Your carving skills are tremendous. As for the cannon height. I never had a problem there. It was all about the flow of the gunwales and whether the ports themselves should be perfectly square or not. Here is a link to my cannon height jig.

http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/45-rattlesnake-by-jpett-model-shipways-ms2028-scale-164th/?p=399

It was made during Gun Port "take 1"

 

Augie: Don't make me use the "P" word. You know where that goes

 

Sam: Thx, Always good to see you aboard

 

Ferit:  See, I told you so. I would never dump my baby for another pretty face.

 

Patrick: Yes, sawdust is a good thing

 

Popeye: Not sure I figured it out this time. Still have lots to learn and God willing many years to learn it. As for the deck. "NO" the instructions have the deck going in after I plank the wales and ceilings (inner wales). I put in the two runners to prevent the planking from warping the hull if that is where you were coming from. They were not in the instructions but from a book I read on planking.

 

Martin:  "unobtainable ideal" Can I borrow this ?  

 

John: Thx, looking forward to wishing you the same. Be safe on your trip.

 

Michael: Funny, I feel the same way about your log. Treenails and all

 

Eric: Always a pleasure to see another Rattlesnake Shipwright aboard

 

 

Back to the build

 

Well they are finally done. Are they perfect "no" am I happy with them, happy enough for me to move forward, are they right, that is ironically a good question. As luck would have it the last gun port I did; I managed to make almost perfectly square in a difficult position and it actually "looks right". This contradicts everything I thought I figured out.  I was completely dumbfounded. I Photo Shopped a square inside the port to high light it. I am not sure if this is a high point or a low one. On the happy side; my work to maintain the line that the laser cut Forecastle covering board requires looks good so far. Anyone following this build should take note of these parts and their importance to how the top of the wales are shaped at the bow.

 

As for any fix on the gun ports, I may or may not attempt to make some minor adjustments in the ports while planking to see if they could truly all be made square. The plans do not show them as square but a very good source tells me they are. That and most kit supplied gun ports are. I am truly perplexed by this.

 

As for Planking the gun wales I will be pre-staining or actually dying the wood using water based oil paint before installing it. Similar to what I believe Ben did on his Confed, I will be using paint instead. This will again be a learning experience for me which I am very much looking forward to. I also need to trim out the starboard window and then make the call on framing them. Suggestions welcome

Edited September 29, 2013 by JPett

[Blue Ensign]

 Looking at your photos JP I think she is going to turn out just fine once the bulwarks are planked, I see a very attractive model developing.

 

Regards,

 

B.E.

[popeye the sailor]

with the hull planked as well as you have it.......I think warping is the last thing that will happen.    very nicely done 

[augie]

Nice to see her back on course.

[augie]

There's the 'p' word  

[mtaylor]

Nice work on the gunports, JP.   I see you ran into the rule that "all rules are not hard and fast".  Some ships the ports were perfectly square, others the sills matched the deck.   Hell, I'm still wrestling with the rule of: "bridle ports never have guns"... 

[sport29652]

Mark-What were bridle ports for? JP I hope I have a why is this square moment. My front are rear port look a bit off. Painting has slowed me a bit. 5th coat and can still see primer

[src]

JP, like always, looks great - no green eyed monster here! 

I am curious how you will dye with an oil based paint? My understanding of paint, stain, and dye is that they have a progressively smaller pigment. Following your progress I have no doubt it will look great, just not following the concept.  I will be watching and learning.

 

edit  How rude of me not to sign my name!

 

Sam

Edited September 29, 2013 by src

[mtaylor]

Mark-What were bridle ports for? JP I hope I have a why is this square moment. My front are rear port look a bit off. Painting has slowed me a bit. 5th coat and can still see primer

 

Those are the foremost port on each side.  Some ships leave them unfilled by guns to ease in anchor handling.  Others had a gun there.  I still haven't figured out the criteria as to whether it was Captain's choice or some regulation.

[popeye the sailor]

Captain's choice I would say.........some even had "bow chasers" on the fore deck.   a second pair down below

[sport29652]

Thanks mark.

[patrickmil]

JP, your Rattlesnake's gunports look great. I'm anxious to see these next steps with how you color your planking material.

[Martin W]

Nice photos, JPett -- all the different angles consistently show her to be pretty doggone true.  The Rattlesnake is a pretty ship, and your build is doing her justice.

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

[ZevEisenberg]

@JPett,

 

I’ve gone through your build log (skimming, so maybe I missed something), and I have two questions:

 

1. You seem to have cut off the horizontal part of the bulkhead that will hold the quarter deck. Why? Were they just getting in the way? I know I’ve accidentally snapped and re-glued a couple of mine already. Did you keep the parts so you can reattach them, or are you going to recreate them from scratch?

 

2. I’ve reached the part in my instructions (step 9, in case you have the same ones) where I need to install the covering boards. I had no problem with the bow ones, but I am confused by what the instructions are saying for the stern covering boards. I see only snippets in the plans, and as far as I can tell from your photos, you’ve omitted them entirely. Do you know what the story is here?

Edited October 11, 2013 by ZevEisenberg

[JPett]

Ahoy Zev

 

1) Yes: In the beginning I would glue them back on after a mishap. In the end I just got rid of them. You need to make one for the forecastle and after doing that it was "for me" a no brainer to just replace all of them. The thought of one breaking after I plank the forecastle or quarter deck made me ill. Structurally they are worthless. I did save them "just in case".   

 

2)  If I am understanding you correctly, there are no laser cut pieces for the stern like the forecastle. They are shown on the plan sheet as "rail caps" and the covering boards are what I believe; just the deck planking for the quarter deck.  Both are made from the supplied strip board.

 

 

 

Hope this helps

Edited October 11, 2013 by JPett

[ZevEisenberg]

Jpett,

 

Your answers have been quite helpful.

 

I just re-read your tale of gun port woe. You showed admirable dedication to getting them right! You have (hopefully) saved me some strife as I start my own gun ports. For example, I’m going to skip right ahead to using repurposed deck planking instead of 1/16″ square strips at your recommendation (and it makes sense - 1/16th seemed too flimsy when I read it in the plans).

 

As to my previous questions, I am going to try to leave the quarter deck and forecastle supports in for now and not break them but we’ll see. And it looks like I will be skipping the main, forecastle, and quarter deck rails and the forecastle and quarter deck breast beams until after I have finished the hull planking. It doesn’t seem like they’re needed until before the deck planking, and the rails seem to make much more sense after hull planking.

 

Your pioneering build has helped to pave the way. Thank you!

[JPett]

Ahoy Mates

 

Zev: NP

 

Thought I should post an update on my progress and head off the rumors of another woman in my life.

 

Work has progressed very slowly for me at this stage. As anybody following my log knows, gunports have been a difficult subject for me. With this said, I decided to up the steaks and switch out the supplied 3/32nd by 1/32 basswood with Boxwood.

 

For anybody interested; the boxwood made a considerable difference in the strength of my gunwales: but it required a slightly higher skill level to work and some additional tool expenditures. I used my Vanda Lay to mill out the planks for the ports which was very helpful but in the end I still spent hours tuning them with a super sharp skinny Xacto blade (see pic insert and my Strop post). I also had to throw in a few cheaters to fudge my sills around plank seams.

 

Once done I was treated to the fact that no two of my gunports were the same size. This debacle took me hours to fix. It was very unnerving to trim the hardwood planking and not cut out the basswood gunport sill directly behind it or carve out something unwanted in the front. Beer was used to settle my nerves after each session.  While not perfect I am stopping now before I do something I regret. See I can learn.

 

Just not too much at once 

 

For reasons unknown. I decided I would sand off the lip of the wales in the bow and create more work for myself. While the bulk of this repair is done. (Sorry no pics, I used CA, tape and accelerator) It still needs a little TLC (wood filler). I also dropped the black wale down slightly in the bow. My earlier error tapering the wale planks (don't do this) was highlighted by this work. It still is, just not as badly now.

 

I am not sure if I will do any treenails on the gunwales. I might flank the gunports ports with railroad spikes "ala" MDJ's Wasa. If I do any treenails they would have be the simulated "bolt" style I recently learned. My concern is how they will look on the 3/32nd wood with the real ones on the hull. I also plan on another full blown TN party for the deck.

 

It just might be too many treenails. If there is such a thing

 

I  went with black on the ports (not red) and will be changing the color of the fashion piece on the stern to match this ( I liked what Eric did). For the Gunwales I am currently playing with a light wash of Ochre. My original staining Idea hit a reef and went down like Miley at the VMA's on the 5th plank. The inner wales or ceilings will be basswood with natural finish like the hull. .

 

Am I happy? I will give this a passing grade but hope to do a slightly better job on the Starboard side. Now that I know some of the pitfalls.  

Edited October 15, 2013 by JPett