allanyed
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Welcome aboard Amphibette. Do you own or have you sailed on an Amphibette? That would be a fun project for a model. Allan
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Bug Your idea to replace the kit figurehead has opened up a world of new ideas for the rest of our community, including the carvers, even if only to look for a maquette. Allan- 419 replies
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Your ship model is looking quite good Candice. Regarding the boat which you affectionately called the little guy can be a relatively easy build if you don't use the kit design which looks nothing like the launch or any other boats found on the Bounty or other British ships. If you do a little research here on MSW you will find quite a few posts on building a ship's boat that will look realistic. There are also detailed drawings and scantlings in various books that will help you. Feel free to PM me if you are interested in some drawings, scantlings, and explanations that I can share. Allan
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HMS Bounty by AdamA - 1:48
allanyed replied to AdamA's topic in - Build logs for subjects built 1751 - 1800
I second Greg's comment. Patience, sharp tools and probably some do overs rather than settling and there is the recipe for an achievable feat by other builders. Allan -
Great pics, thanks for posting. Obviously no big bumps or other types of markings other than the little nails used. Not sure if this has come up on any posts concerning the copper sheathing, but I imagine if the real sheathing had huge bumps like on most of the kit supplied plating, there would be as much drag on the hull as a hull fouled with barnacles and seaweed which no sailor would want. Allan
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Below is a photo of plating on CS. You can decide which of the scale sizes of plates you shop for are most appropriate. I cannot speak for CS, but the RN plating was typically 48"x15" with a 1.5" overlap much like done with roof shingles. If this holds true for CS the shingles should be about 0.2" X 0.67". The sketch below is based on the details from Goodwin in his book, The Construction and Fitting of the English Man of War. Allan
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Rob, Welcome to MSW. Please do write a short intro about yourself on the new member forum. Glues vary with the material to be glued. Some folks use various types of what is commonly called carpenter's glue for wood to wood bonding, and epoxy for metal to metal or metal to wood. Others prefer cyanoacrylate. What items did you have in mind to paint and what items did you have in mind to stain? If you can be more specific and post some photos of your model, I am sure you will get answers from members based on personal experiences. Again, welcome aboard. Allan
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Ton Did you check with architectural blueprint firms? It has been some years for me since using them, but I never paid more than $10 per drawing if B&W. Color was higher but, with the exception of the inboard profile drawing, color was unnecessary. Allan
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Dearborn The painted bottom looks great and might be best left as is unless you have accurate looking sheathing. The vast majority of copper bottomed models in the build logs have out-of-scale copper sheathing with the giant pimples or huge etched marks that are supposed to represent 1/4" nails. Amati offers two types, one being the more common out of scale stuff we see on so many models, but they make some realistic materials as well. https://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/acatalog/4392-04-Set-of-Copper-Hull-Plates-17x5mm-1-72-Scale-A4392_04.html#SID=1061 You can also make your own with copper tape which requires no gluing and marking the TINY nail indentations with a properly sized pounce wheel. The pic below is from a build log here at MSW. You can easily see the difference between this realistic plating and the more common plating in the second picture. If you keep in mind these plates were overlapped horizontally and vertically and note the attached with 1/4" nails that have 1/2" heads ( (0.007"at 1:72) you can decide which you feel is more realistic. A photo of nails from the copper sheathing on the Bounty next to a two pence piece is below.
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Rudy It appears that you forgot to taper the plank. I see what looks like tick marks on the frames but they look to be spaced the same on each frame whereas they should be spaced closer together as you move forward and wider as you move aft. If you don't taper the planks you will run out of space at the bow and have gaps aft. All planks need to end in the rabbet fore and aft except if if you wind up needing a drop strake forward or a stealer aft. As your vessel appears to be a small one, neither a drop nor a stealer should be required. There are a lot of posts here at MSW on this as well as on at least one of planking tutorials here at MSW. The https://thenrg.org/resources/Documents/articles/APrimerOnPlanking.pdf article goes into spiling as well as tapering but you can also use the method Gregory references from Syren above as both work well. Allan
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Copper plates
allanyed replied to Barbara's topic in Building, Framing, Planking and plating a ships hull and deck
Rick, Excellent photo, thank you very much for posting this. Allan -
Copper plates
allanyed replied to Barbara's topic in Building, Framing, Planking and plating a ships hull and deck
The following site was posted on a build log here at MSW. Looking at photos of the nails for copper plating pretty well shows that those giant pimples on most kit supplied sheathing look nothing like what was used on the ships. https://www.bbc.co.uk/ahistoryoftheworld/objects/v8RrCz_SRtCcGn6qcOQXsA What looks like a two pence piece in the photo is 1.02" diameter so it is easy to see these nails are about 0.25" with a head that is about 0.5" that would make an indentation when hammered into place, not 2"-3" raised bumps or etched circles found on most kit supplied sheathing. Smaller scale models may be better served not to show the pattern on the sheathing at all. Allan -
Andrew, Thank you for posting these sites. On the first is a photo of the nails along what looks like a two pence piece. The two pence is 1.04" diameter and the nails look to be right at or very close to 0.25" diameter (with 0.5" heads). This confirms information from Goodwin's Construction and Fitting of the English Man of War. Anyone coppering Bounty or any other ship should take note of this as the stuff in the kits seen here at MSW has huge pimples or etched circles that are, at scale, closer to 2" in diameter, or larger, instead of tiny dents. Those that have made their own with copper tape and attention is paid to these tiny nail indentations do a better job than the kit makers. Thanks again for the links. Allan
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As the metal work will be black, maybe consider copper instead of brass in the future as you can blacken it in situ with liver of sulfur which will not stain the wood. If I remember correctly Ed Tosti goes into some detail on this in his Naiad build log and/or his Young America build log here at MSW. Allan
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Christian, Regarding your jig fixture, another new day, another new idea, at least from what I have seen. Are you gluing up the frames while in the jig, and if you are, any problems arising with the frame being glued into the jig and having problems getting it out? Are you using a CNC mill? Sorry for all the questions, but I find your method fascinating. Allan
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Dearborn Welcome aboard!! Hope to see your progress photos on a build log in the near future. Allan
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Dominic Your post above might come from the following article --> https://www.boatbuilding.xyz/hms-bounty/decoration.html This is not contemporary information so may or may not be accurate. Allan
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Welcome to MSW Carl, It would be nice if you would post a little introduction about yourself on the new member forum here at MSW. https://modelshipworld.com/forum/3-new-member-introductions/ In the meantime is the surface that is to be painted fiberglass, epoxy resin, gel coat or? I did a quick check on the net about appropriate coatings for epoxy resin and invariably they recommend acrylics or even latex coatings. Allan
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Master Korabel and Falkonet models availability
allanyed replied to grsjax's topic in Wood ship model kits
FWIW https://www.jdsupra.com/legalnews/new-u-s-sanctions-and-export-controls-2030135/ Allan -
Welcome to MSW Sbagg. It would be great if you would post a little intro about yourself on the new member forum. Regarding your question, a few photos and more information might help. What is the material of the rigging line? If the lines actually just fall off/break on their own you might want to consider re-rigging with new line or is it that they have just come untied? The fact that it got brittle in the first place is strange in itself, but are the lines parting at the knots or elsewhere? Again, welcome to MSW Allan
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There is a high resolution (39mb) contemporary inboard profile drawing of Seahorse 1794, an Artois class vessel on the Wiki commons site. It shows how high the tops of the scuttles are above the decks. The same low res drawing is also on the RMG Collections website.) The high resolution drawing is at https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Ship_plans_of_the_Royal_Museums_Greenwich Scroll to the second page and there are several drawings of her including the inboard profile (J7956) which shows the heights above the deck of all the coamings on each deck. There is one opening on the QD about 2 or 3 feet aft of the main mast that does not show a coaming. The others on all decks do have coamings of various heights above the decks. There appear to be coamings on the contemporary model of Diana at RMG https://www.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/rmgc-object-66533 There is a complete set of drawings of the Artois class including another inboard profile drawn in 1793 https://www.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/rmgc-object-82176 but it is low resolution so difficult to see as clearly as the high resolution drawing mentioned above. Allan
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Jeff, She is a very well constructed model, congratulations. I do notice there are belaying pins which is curious as they were not used on British ships before 1770 and Revenge ran aground in 1591. Am I correct in assuming this is a kit design error? Thanks Allan
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Rudy, When you say two garboard planks on the starboard side do you mean two strakes of planking or two pieces of planking making up the single garboard strake? I may have missed something but I never read of two garboard strakes on each side. For the single strake, the planks that make up the garboard are usually no more than 30 feet long so your ship and scale will determine the length of each plank of the garboard strake. For a better picture of what I am describing go to the RMG Collections site. https://www.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/rmgc-object-83495 is a planking expansion drawing. The lower set is the outboard planking and the garboard is the lowest strake and is made up of four pieces of planking mated to the rabbet. Note that the forward end does not go very far up the stem. Many models have the garboard going too far up the stem and wind up with planking that is more akin to a Viking ship which of course would be appropriate if you are building a Viking ship. 😀 Allan
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JB I second Mercator's comments on Vanguard but would also add the David Antcherl series of models from Model Shipways. Do you care if your model is a truly accurate representation of a real ship? If you do, study the build logs here and do a little research on the ship of your choice before buying the kit to see if the kit maker has done a good job in their representation. As can be clearly seen in many build logs, unfortunately many, not all, kit manufacturers have done an extremely poor job in producing a kit that yields a realistic looking model, including the one you mention. A great place to do research is RMG. For the Bounty as one example------------- https://www.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/rmgc-object-86459 shows the deck layouts. A model held at RMG with several views can be seen at https://www.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/rmgc-object-68763 Allan
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Welcome Docker!! I look forward to your forthcoming build log. Where are in you France? We have been very fortunate to visit many times and find that we love all parts of your country especially Nice, the Loire, Provence, Paris and Normandy to name a few. We are now making plans to be back in the late spring of 2023! Passe une bonne journee Allan
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