allanyed
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Everything posted by allanyed
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If you look at the shape of the garboard strake on a plank expansion plan it may help you to shape the strake. While it tapers along its length in some cases, the key is for the forward end not to go too far up the rabbet at the stem. One example is https://www.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/rmgc-object-83495 The upper is the ceiling planking and the lower is the hull planking. Allan -
Your following the tutorials for planking has resulted in one of the finest planking jobs in the kit build logs here at MSW. It can serve as a lesson to others that no one is relegated to using the erroneous methods shown by some kit makers where many the planks fail to end at the rabbet as they should. With this being your first build, the build log is even more impressive. Allan
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Chimp, I agree that "artistic license" is a good term, albeit much too kind in some cases. Thanks for posting the drawing. Like you I would trust the research done by Marquardt in the AOTS book before the kit. Allan
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How was a ship's launch boat prepped to sail?
allanyed replied to Peanut6's topic in Masting, rigging and sails
Kev, Your questions are great and I am very curious to see the answers posted based on contemporary information. If you rig your launch model as a double lug sail boat like it is thought that Bligh rigged her, I don't think there is a bow sprit about which to worry which would not be the case if cutter rigged. I have been unable to find a contemporary drawing or model, so far, of a lug rig with a sprit. Perhaps if there are any detailed contemporary plans and/or models showing the rigging up close, that would help get an idea on how things were done. I for one am very interested to see if there are any rigging plans based on contemporary information. Aside,,,, a golf buddy who works for BMW just spent two days driving three of the hottest Beamers around the Indy short track, full road course, and main track. He said it is really pretty country where you are and of course the driving was absolutely thrilling. Allan -
The Anatomy of Nelson's Ships book is fantastic and you are to be complimented for not using any information in the kit without verifying it first. But to know what applies and what does not would take hours of research to compare each item in a more complete book on rigging such as Lee's Masting and Rigging English Ships of War which covers a range of sizes and years. With the investment in money and time you have already made, Lees' book is a worthwhile incremental investment to consider for this project and future projects. Allan
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Welcome to MSW. What name would you prefer to be called unless Weedboy 11 is what you want. I am sure there is an interesting story there. 😀 You might want to consider writing a post in the new member section and give a little background about yourself. Welcome again, and good luck on your build!! Allan
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What's a good kit for learning rigging?
allanyed replied to Mark m's topic in Masting, rigging and sails
Mark, Good for you on the first builds! I would consider investing in a couple books as well as vetting which model to buy to be sure of the kit accuracy and some "how to" advice. A quick start is to look at the build logs and see what the various kits offer. Check little things such as if the kit offers cheap string instead of miniature rope, realistic looking blocks, realistically scaled belaying pins, accurate belaying points, etc. Once you have narrowed it down, post here and ask for opinions. For details on actual rigging, Lees' Masting and Rigging English Ships of War is hard to beat. A lot of folks recommend Petersson's book Rigging Period Ship Models which unfortunately is limited in scope and gives no information on how to actually do anything. Then again, if you happen to be building a fifth rate vessel from about 1785, it will be very useful. For actual "how-to" practices, Volume IV of The Fully Framed Model series is helpful even though it is centered around Swan class vessels. Of course there are hundreds of pieces of great information here at MSW on how members do things that are extremely helpful for both what they have done that works and what they have done that does not work so well. Allan -
Thanks Clementine. Are these supplied with the kit? If so, does the kit give these items a name? Hal, you bring up a good point on the number of hammocks as two hammocks were issued to the crew members starting in 1804. Consideration should also be taken regarding which watch system was used as the three watch became the fashion in the 19th century. If 1/3 of the crew was sleeping at a given time there would be about 100 hammocks not in use, but the model shows 200. If you compare contemporary drawings and paintings, including the one above and the one at https://www.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/rmgc-object-113120 at RMG, there is a vast difference with those from the kit. I go with the contemporary information based on the fact that the belaying pins in the kit are triple or quadruple the diameter they should be and the hammocks (if that is what they are supposed to be) much too small. Allan
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Hi Clementine What are the white cylinders in the pic below? I thought maybe hammocks but there are about 100 of them on each side and the crew was only 65 plus they are about the same size of the belaying pins. There is something similar in the drawing from Darwin's Journal (1890 edition), but there are only about 25 on each side, so maybe hammocks in the drawing? Just curious to see what these represent. Thank you. Allan
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The devil is in the details BE. I sometimes envy those that are not into the details as it alleviates a lot of frustration, but there is something positive to be said for the fun of the research into the little things. I just did a double check and you are right, I mistook a line that I thought was an additional spoke, my apologies. The sixth rate models that I found all have 8 or 10 spokes. https://www.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/rmgc-object-66436 is one example. Allan
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The ratlines look great. It is great to see the detail of having them end at the second shroud from aft except where every sixth went to the swifter when there was an odd number or aftermost shroud when there was an even number. Kudos! Allan
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David, Thank you for posting the silk information. Do they/you have these sizes in tan colors for running rigging as well? Tx!! Allan
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Allen, I can think of no reason why it would be a bad idea to not use the same methodology. Allan
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As Marshall was there, perhaps these ships were exceptions to the norm. Then again, drawing ZAZ3919 shows what looks like 10. No matter, it is not important to most observers and your model looks great. Allan
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Your model looks terrific! Hope you don't mind one question, regarding the wheel. Looking at other Sphinx builds I am guessing the wheel is from the kit, but wonder why it has twelve spokes instead of the normal 10 spokes. I looked at a number of photos of contemporary models, including sixth rates and referenced Lavery's Arming and Fitting of English Ships of War and I could not find a ship for which the wheel had twelve spokes. From Lavery, page 23, Most wheels had ten spokes, so they were fitted at an angle of 36 degrees to one another. A few smaller wheels had eight spokes. There is no mention of any wheel with twelve spokes, so I was wondering, is Lavery wrong? Thanks again for sharing your build. Allan
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Hi Bob, Hard to tell from your photo but the one block looks to be backwards such that the line will not roll over the would be sheave. Allan
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At 1:76 the scale diameter of the treenails used on deck planking would be about 0.01" Finding a drill bit that small would be a challenge, and making consistent dots with a 0.3mm pencil lead would be a challenge. Even a #80 drill bit is 30% too large. When in doubt, leave it out. Allan
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Hi Alan, The short answer is that carronades did not always count for some time period. There were variations on the 74's from their inception to the American war, and again from the American war to the Napoleonic war so to be more specific, the date in which you are interested needs to be a bit more specific. Caruana goes into a lot detail across 7 or 8 pages as to numbers of each size gun and location for each time period, including the introduction of the Gover guns in volume 2 of The History of English Sea Ordnance. There are a lot of photos of contemporary models of 74s on the RMG site that might help. Allan
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Below are two contemporary models at Preble Hall. All the running rigging is in place, but no sails. There are many examples of this at Preble and in photos of rigged models sans sails on the RMG Collections site. Take the virtual tour of Preble Hall and "walk" upstairs for more examples. usna.edu/museum/3dtour.php which Brian Falke posted yesterday. It took me a little time to get the hang of walking through doors, going upstairs, and maneuvering around each model to get views from bow, stern and sides, but well worth the effort. Allan
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If anyone has an opportunity to visit, don't miss the chance. I was lucky to tour with Grant Walker on one of several visits (see photo I took below). Ed Tosti, Wayne Kempson and I carpooled to Preble and had a grand day. Allan
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Thanks Brian, Probably just me, but how do you get out of the lobby and onto the other floor level where all the models are? Their idea is great but I cannot figure how to get to where the good stuff is which I think was on a different floor lever, including the wood shop where they repair, etc. Allan
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Hammer Look at some contemporary models and paintings of ships in drydock for repairs. They have no sails, often the upper masts are not in place, and sometimes the lower masts are unstepped depending on the amount and type of repairs. You could also build the hull on the building slip. There are many examples, both contemporary and modern, that you can see with a few minutes search. Don't go by the well known Underhill model from 1950 that has the ship on the building ways and fully rigged. Per RMG, that model was more of a lesson on building a model than accuracy of the the scene itself. Then again, this may be what you would like. 😀https://www.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/rmgc-object-68469 Other ideas Ship under repair drawing: Example of a contemporary model on the ways, from Preble Hall at the academy. Old Buckler's Hard diorama located at Buckler's Hard museum
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As mentioned above, if you decide to go with sails, silk span or similar non-woven material is a great choice as cloth is totally unrealistic if you are interested in scale accuracy. If scale is not a concern for you and you want to use cloth, try to use super high thread count (TC) cloth material. Consider investing $7 and buying the sail making booklet by David Antscherl offered by SeaWatch Books. I understand it is currently sold out but the owner Michael may be able to give you info on when a reprint will be available. There are You Tube tutorials that give similar methods using SS. Allan
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Schooner Your methodology is spot on. Totally agree with your choice of glue as well. Marking out where to bevel the bulkheads is a great idea. Holly is a great wood for decks. It has the color of a holystoned deck and is readily available from the normal wood suppliers mentioned here at MSW. As you are starting to plank the hull, do you plan to plank as the kit instructs or have you considered realistic looking planking instead? If case you are not aware, there is a great Antscherl tutorial here at MSW and there is a four part Passaro video series on-line on proper planking. Thanks for sharing your build with us. Allan
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Shipwreck The Gloucester hailed most important since Mary Rose
allanyed replied to Kevin's topic in Nautical/Naval History
Thank you very much for posting the link Kevin, it is a very interesting read. Allan
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