vaddoc

Looks fantastic Hakan. This dark shade really lifts the model, I like it a lot. You could consider using treenails for those stringers, would be more secure and easier than glue.

Now, if I could take a guess, is your next boat a pilot cutter?

Some more work done, time for another post.

I installed both garboards, even after steaming some pressure was needed to get them fully into position. Initially I used 1 mm screws to keep the planks in the correct position and then gradually replaced with treenails. I had to deepen the rabet, at places quite a lot. I am not too happy with the bow end of the port plank, it should be spot on but now there is a bit of a gap. Oh well, a bit of filler never did any harm!

Then I moved on to the next plank which I think should be the stealer.

So, first a defined the shape that the first broad strake should have. This plank, up to a point, it follows the edge of the garboard but at some point it deviates and this is where the stealer starts. The stealer will not have a pointy end but a square one which will sit within the first broad plank. So things should look something like this:

The position where the two plank ends meet should be here

Then I laid a baten to define a fair upper edge for the stealer

However, when I cut the plank template it does not look right. It seems it needs shortening by one frame.

So that is what I did. It looks much better now. I had to make sure that the first broad plank, which now will be longer, will not be too wide for the curve it must negotiate but it looks fine.

Ten I cut the stealer. With a bit of adjustment, it fitted fine.

Now, at this point I was curious whether this plank would fit on the other side. It should, as the upper edge of the garboard should be finishing at the same point at all frames in both sides. Well, it does!

Then I made the other stealer which also came out fine

So all looks good so far. However, today I remembered some more planking tricks and tips. It is coming back to me as I progress.

After the plank is cut, minor adjustments can be done by scraping the edge of the plank with the knife. It works like a plane. But also, again using the knife as scraper, the other edge of the plank needs to be "planed" into a fair curve to make it easier to mate with next plank without gaps. Further more, the plank can be cut with the scroll saw to just out of the line and then with the knife plane down to the line. For this to work, very sharp blades are needed so I change mine very often.

Regards to all 

Vaddoc

Jim and to everyone that hit the like button, many thanks! I think time for another small post.

I ve been thinking how to attach the planks to the frames, for the Yawl I ll use threaded brass wire but I do not think this will be possible for this boat, I do not trust the plywood frames to hold the threads securely. So I am thinking of using treenails, like I did with the Deben. I think I ll need 1500-2000 (including wastage) for the outer planking alone so I sat down to make them.

I used the needle method, in the past I ve made many thousand of treenails. I used a small log  a friend gave me a couple of years ago, I am not sure what tree it came from, either hawthorn or hornbeam. It is a hard and strong wood though. It took a while to make things work, I kept burning the wood but with a bit of trial and error I managed to get things working.

I cut thin discs and drilled the tree nails. Then I sanded the back and released the nails. The heartwood was very hard and the sapwood at areas seemed to have deposits that clogged the needle.

I was not too happy with the first bunch, they were quite short. I sorted the nails according to colour, I ll use the lighter ones that are more plentiful. The darker ones are from the heartwood, denser and stronger but even the lighter ones are very strong. In the next photo they don't seem a lot but actually they are more than 800.

Then I sat down and made a few more, this time longer and better. This time I made close to 2000, so I should have enough to start planking.

So time to steam the planks! The garboards are the more difficult to fit, the twist of the plank is significant and really the clamps are difficult to be positioned securely.

My steamer worked brilliantly and despite taking a long time to fit the plank so that it cooled down halfway through positioning, it accepted the twist just fine. I need to deepen the bevel in a few areas but otherwise I am happy with the outcome.

Tomorrow if possible I ll nail the planks to position but I need to think of a way to make sure all the nails align across all planks and that are spaced equally.

Vaddoc

How about mixing epoxy with brass dust (sold on ebay) and then just touching the outer end of the 0.4 mm wire to leave a blob of 0.8 mm. 

Is this helpful?

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Prym-0-60-Straight-Brass-Pins/dp/B0027IZTP4/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=Prym+0.60+x+14+mm+25+g+Straight+Brass+Pins&qid=1613847521&s=kitchen&sr=1-1

How very nice! Indeed, these details have made a world of difference. This is a fantastic model GL.

Well Art, I got motivated by your thread and built my version of a steam box. Dead easy to make, tried it today, huge success!

Materials (This side of the pond): 2 planned wood planks from B&Q at £9 each and a wallpaper steamer at £30 and scrap wood. I did not put a drain hole, the water drained from the (not so) closed end. The door was undersized so that steam could escape.

After 2 min of steaming, the 2.2 mm thick beech planks could be tied to a knot!

I converted form soft solder with a heat iron to silver solder. I use the Proxon torch which is excellent.

Silver soldering needs parts to be very clean and in contact but at least for me is more controllable and easier to work with. I use phos solder paste so when polished it does not stand out against the brass parts. I could never control the soft solder in the same way-strength is a non issue. 

In regards to equipment, it really depends on the scale you work and how large and thick the pieces are. If the pieces to be soldered are large, a powerful iron is needed to deliver the energy to raise the temperature. If they are too large, it may not work.

Even with silver soldering, I had a few large pieces to solder and the Proxon torch was not adequate-I have a much bigger torch for these.

Any of the irons you ve looked at will do the job.

Looks good George! What is the sea made of?

Some more progress so time for another post.

Many thanks to all for your likes and comments!

Now, in the previous post we have cut one of the garboards so next task is to cut its sister plank. This was much more difficult and more complicated than I expected.

The two sides of the hull are not as symmetrical as they should or could be. The garboard I ve cut will not fit on the other side. I am not sure what is the issue, I think the rabet is not cut at the same height in a few areas but everything else looks ok. Still, it will not fit.

I marked the frames to determine where the new garboard should reach and using a paper template I cut the new garboard.

The plank did not come out right. There are unacceptable gaps with the rabet and at places it is not wide enough.

Using the plank as template, I filled the gaps and then with a compass measured the widths again but this time used a different baten to connect the dots, a 2x2 mm pear strip. This time the plank looked better.

It actually looks better than the first garboard! On the boat, the two garboards look identical but put on top of each other, their shape is similar but they do not fully much. But it also true that even tiny variations in the frames will massively affect the curvature of the planks. 

The next photo shows the first plank, the gaps are a bit larger but nothing terrible.

I think also the rabet is not deep enough, I wonder if it would be simpler to sand the plank. They are actually a bit thicker than 2 mm.

The work will now need to stop, I need to make a steamer device to steam the planks. Also I need to add some wood to the horn timbers for the planks to rest on.

Vaddoc

40 minutes ago, Don Case said:

One thing I learned about wooden steam boxes is don't get silly with quality, especially if you use plywood. They delaminate after a while. Close joints are a waste of time, you need a good flow of steam anyway. The first one I made I did a primo job, all glued and nailed and tight. After a few months it was all warped and peeled.

I was thinking solid wood planks or better sacrificial plywood but maybe PVC pipe is the way forward. 

GL, the boat came out fantastic, lovely details! Your confidence working with metal and wood, both large chunks and tiny pieces, is impressive. A very enjoyable log apart from the "sticking a pole to the whale's blow hole" part!

On 2/1/2021 at 12:52 AM, Osmosis said:

All in all this certainly exceeded my expectations. Not just in the result but in the process also.

 

Excellent Art, your steamer seems to be working well. Now, I need to make a similar one!

I have two boats to plank, about 50 planks altogether of 2 mm beech. 

I am thinking to make a long box out of plywood, with one end closed, apart from an opening to accept the steam feed hose, the other with a loose fitting cap and a rag so steam can escape. I presume a drain hole will be needed, probably just drill a hole but attach a hose so that the condensation be directed to a bucket to avoid making a mess.

As you report things will get pretty hot in there so some caution will be needed. 

I ll post my results

So sorry for your loss Michael. When I was much younger our cat died after being part of our lives for 18 years. I still think of him and visiting familiar places miss his presence.

Fantastic metal work Keith but the net indeed is a step further. The more I look at it the more difficult it looks...

Just finished going over the entire log JD. Very nice! I enjoyed the transom bit very much, properly complex to make!

Could I share couple of thoughts:

Re your issues with the height and position of frames, position of rabet and the shape/angle of transom: Rhino is really powerful, it can give you all these answers. One solution is to extend the frames, sternpost and stem beyond the sheer to the same horizontal plane. This way all frames and transom will sit at the proper height. You can also project the transom to an appropriately angled plane to get its shape. Also, perhaps consider before tackling the frame shape to first fully define sheer, rabet and edge of transom as a continuity.

I am very interested to see how you ll approach the planking, at this scale you ll probably be able to get away with a lot of edge setting.

Regards

Vaddoc

-3 Hakan but there is wind, real feel -8!

Very nice Hakan. Your frames came out great!

Epoxy thickened with gypsum could be a good alternative with gap filling properties, although epoxy has the potential to cause great mess.

So I gave it another try and this time things worked better.

I actually remembered that planking the Deben, I had laminated the card to double its thickness. So I did the same and indeed the laminated card holds its shape much better. Also, I used spray glue instead of the water based glue sticks. This made a huge difference as the glue dries almost immediately and does not distort the paper.

The new pattern was transferred to the wood but in a different way. I used paper template to define the rabet edge, the stern end and the turn of the plank at the stem. Then, with the compass I transferred the distances at all frame positions and used a baten to connect them with a fair line. This was the outcome, it worked just fine.

Compared to the first plank, it looks more correct as it probably will fill the previous gaps. But the first plank looks just wrong, it is clear the card had distorted at the fore end.

I then tried to install the plank. This was difficult, exactly as the ship builder mentions in the video a few posts earlier, the most difficult thing is to get the plank to twist and this garboard has a huge twist. I had to do a very minimal amount of scraping/sanding and with the help of many clamps, the plank seems to fit well with very little edge bending.

A little filler won't hurt I presume!

Now, all boat building activities are temporarily suspended, not only due to professional and family commitments but also because of the weather-it is freezing cold in Cambridgeshire.

Best wishes

Vaddoc

Indeed Hakan, this is why planks need spilling.  I think the problem is that the card is not stiff enough. I actually have 2 mm thick card that I used to plank the Deben but it is too thick and difficult to cut. I ordered 1 mm thick cardboard, see how this will do

Well, so far planking was all talk and no action. So today I cut the first plank. Yep, it went pear shaped!

Lets go over this failed attempt.

I finished the paper template and it looked ok. I intended the upper edge to be straight, it is not but it is not far off either.

Then I used a batten to connect the markings into a fair curve

The template was cut and seemed ok

Then transferred to the wood sheet. I used one of the warped ones as I suspected this first attempt would not go well.

I used a carpet knife to cut to the line. This went ok but the plank does not fit well.

What went wrong? Well, to start with the plank does not much the template

But also, now the template does not sit as well on the boat!

The card I am using is not stiff enough I think.

Now, this needs some further thought!

Regarding bending wood: In a recent thread on this subject, there was some good info.

• Soaking will make wood bend easier (up to a point) because increasing moisture content destroys some chemical bonds within the wood
• Heat will soften the wood lignin and allow the wood to bend. When cool, the wood will retain its new shape to a large degree
• Moisture will decrease the temperature needed to soften the lignin, depending on species sometimes very dramatically. Usually this temperature is well above 100 degrees C, moisture will bring it bellow 100.

Maybe best to leave the upper edge of the lower plank untouched and bevel the lower edge of the plank above it?

I am still trying to digest question No 3...😁

In this case I would think CA glue, which has actually been used previously in this model and can be removed with debonder. PVA glue might work as well. I wonder if varnish could be an option. Also, in the past I have used women's hair spray to preserve dried flowers, it works very well, it strengthen them and prevents the fragile leaves from falling apart-(is it a form of lacquer?). Maybe it would work.

Dan, I have absolutely no experience in such projects but those lines look too far gone. Even if they can be strengthened, they will probably fall apart soon. Is replacing all rigging an option?

So now it is spilling time!

I tried just a bit of spilling, to see how this would go. I have a feeling it will not be as easy as the last boat due to the more narrow planks.

So we ll start with the garboard. Although the keel is dead straight, the corresponding edge of the garboard will not-there will be a curve to it. I used pieces of card paper to make patterns. The paper is attached to the frames, then a compass is drawn along the rabet at a constant angle, Then the positions of the middle of the frames are marked and the new edge cut.

it actually took two goes as the strip was too thick and was distorting things. After I had the edge, I marked the points where the other edge crosses the middle of the frames. I used the compass to mark this in relation to a random position on the frames.

This cross points will be connected later with a baten so the edge can be drawn. 

I then moved a bit further and repeated the process.

Then I reached the stem with a third piece. All pieces are connected with pieces of card glued at the junctions, in the end we should end up with a solid piece that lies effortlessly on the frames. The rabet edge will be ready, the other will need to be drawn fair with a baten connecting all the cross points. 

Then the plank will need to be cut, shaped appropriately and installed. Then do the same on the other side.

This will be a mountain of work, still the lapstrake on the yawl will be even more difficult.

Best wishes

Vaddoc