USS Gwin (DD-433) by Egilman - DML/Dragon - 1/350th scale - PLASTIC

[kurtvd19]

12 hours ago, Egilman said:

using thinned oil enamels the thinner reacts with the glue in the tape dissolving it

Masking tapes are designed for use with solvent based paints or water based - but few work for both.  Check the tape manufacturer's data sheets for their compatibility.

[Egilman]

12 minutes ago, kurtvd19 said:

Masking tapes are designed for use with solvent based paints or water based - but few work for both.  Check the tape manufacturer's data sheets for their compatibility.

Very, Very true Kurt... 

 

Thanks for mentioning it......

 

And welcome to the log......

Edited December 7, 2020 by Egilman

[Egilman]

Alright, back on track..... 

 

Corrected starboard freeboard......

.......with corrected lines......

And, the navy blue now in it's appropriate places....... (paint is still fresh so it looks a bit darker than it actually is)

That one section on the stern wraps around to the port side giving a navy blue stripe around the stern, so it will wait until I have the Port side laid out and painted....

 

That will start when the starboard side has cured....

[Egilman]

Getting ready to start the port side.... One of the things one needs to watch for when using paint this thin is handling..... it wears off VERY quickly with just a modicum of handling.... So one needs to plan the build accordingly.... Once finished, you need to put a light sealing coat over them...

 

Here is an example of this phenomenon.....

 

You can plainly see where the Ocean Grey has worn off... The paint layers are so thin, you have to be super careful in planning the build cause too much handling can ruin the finish.... Not that we all aren't aware of such being modelers, my point here is it happens four times faster than normal....

 

But this is an easy recoat fix and an hour or two to cure.... The mistake I made on the other side doubled the handling and this is the result....

[mtaylor]

19 hours ago, Egilman said:

Yeah, but youse guys aren't in 1/350th scale.... and the admiral says to behave..... OR ELSE..... (I haven't a clue what or else is) 

 

One never wants to find out what "OR ELSE", means.   

 

You have an interesting technique on the painting.  I'll be interested in seeing how this works out.  I used a brush on my CH-53 but different scale and acrylic only.

 

Back to hanging out in the rafters as we don't get popcorn or nuts falling on us there.

[Egilman]

5 hours ago, mtaylor said:

 

One never wants to find out what "OR ELSE", means.   

 

You have an interesting technique on the painting.  I'll be interested in seeing how this works out.  I used a brush on my CH-53 but different scale and acrylic only.

 

Back to hanging out in the rafters as we don't get popcorn or nuts falling on us there.

Well the "Or Else" statement is something I avoid at all costs if possible....

 

Never tried it with acrylics but I imagine it would work if one figured out the techniques needed for it.... Scale here is the main issue for doing it this way, larger scale models have easier ways of doing it.... Lets see how it comes out in the end.....

 

Well if the popcorn starts falling like rain, we will just have to break out the popcorn catchers.... (falling nuts we break out the sling shots for target practice)

[Egilman]

Another update.....

 

Finished the basic camo pattern on the port side......

 

The stern.....

And a pair of perspective views, Port & Starboard bow.....

Port....

Starboard...

Time to let it fully cure before overcoating it.....

 

Meanwhile, I start on the decks......

 

20B Deck Blue, looks more like a dark grey in the bottle... but first I have to fill the holes for the forward K-guns, the Gwin only carried 4 K-guns launchers two each side abreast the #3 5"-38...

 

Making progress...

 

[lmagna]

4 hours ago, Egilman said:

(falling nuts we break out the sling shots for target practice)

Nuts are too valuable to waste by tossing them down onto the dockyard, so no ammo for you. Only the shells get tossed as they are only good for brushing onto the floor. So if the Admiral says anything we will blame you. We are not complete dummies up here!

 

I like the way the camo pattern came out. it is thin like you wanted, but it is also slightly translucent and that makes it look slightly faded as I am almost certain is a more accurate look for any time other than a week out of drydock before wind and elements took over.

[Egilman]

13 hours ago, lmagna said:

We are not complete dummies up here

I expected nothing less.... {chuckle}

[Egilman]

13 hours ago, lmagna said:

I like the way the camo pattern came out. it is thin like you wanted, but it is also slightly translucent and that makes it look slightly faded as I am almost certain is a more accurate look for any time other than a week out of drydock before wind and elements took over.

Of the four destroyers, two were repainted in Norfolk NS just days before they left, I don't believe the Gwin was one of those repaints... The Hornet was repainted as well, judging from the pics I would say that the paint has three month wear and tear on it..... That would be right about the time some fading and salt streaking chalkyness would start showing up.... The Gwin was taken off convoy duty about a month before joining DesDiv 22, she would have been repainted at that time..... So I think it fits what she should look like.....

 

Thank you Lou, great minds think alike.....

[Egilman]

Update on the deck painting....

 

20B Deck Blue was the darkest color on the ship, but when painted it was very close to 5-N Navy Blue, also, the decks took a lot of abuse and were constantly being repainted so they have a splotchy look......

Two coats....

 

It's actually too splotchy here so I needed to get a third coat down....

 

You can see from the shininess that it isn't completely cured yet, and the blotchyness is there but much subdued from the two coat stage..... Next step is to let it cure completely, put down a very thin coat of future, and install the anti-slip deck decals.... Then touch up the hull edges, assemble the deck on the hull and give it a thin dull coat.....

 

Deck sitting on the hull...

Soon I'll be superstructuring!!!!

 

Onward...

 

[lmagna]

11 minutes ago, Egilman said:

great minds think alike.....

That may cover you other guys. I normally just flap my mouth, (Or point my fingers in this case) with what little mind I have completely out of gear. Comes from years of practice.

[Egilman]

4 hours ago, lmagna said:

That may cover you other guys. I normally just flap my mouth....

Brother, we all flap our mouths, if we didn't we wouldn't be here..... (well in this case twinkle our finners over the board) 

 

Years of practice? been practicing since I was born.... (according to some people) And according to the war department my mind hasn't been in gear for a couple of decades.....

 

Keep on keepin on brother, don't let anyone stop you.... 

 

(and if they try they will deal with me and I'm sure several others around here)

[popeye the sailor]

camo is look'in really good.......nice progress.  

[Egilman]

3 hours ago, popeye the sailor said:

camo is look'in really good.......nice progress.  

Thanks Dennis... It's appreciated...

[Egilman]

Ok another short update....

 

Decaling the decks.....  Not for the faint hearted, and I don't know if your even going to be able to see them on the finished model....

 

Those greyish strips on the deck surface are supposed to represent the anti-skid stripping the crew put down.... (they were pretty much the "Peel n Stick" variety so the yard personnel had more important things to do) In real life they are black but they just disappear in the deck blue surface.... once down, all you can see is the decal film..... I guess I'll have to see what they do when flatcoated....

 

They are taking more time than I thought they would, it's not like putting decals on a car or airplane, The decals are nice though, no trimming needed, they have no film edge....

 

Might not see them at all, anyways, I KNOW they are there... {chuckle}

 

EG

[Egilman]

Another small update my friends...

 

I've found that my upper hull has an issue.... it's bowed...

It shows up with the main deck laying on the upper hull....

That gap between the main deck at the foc'sl break and the hull....

 

So I guess I'll have to mount the upper to the lower hull,  this will pull out most of the bow... (and disguise what remains)  Probably the best way forward in the long run for adding the furniture and superstructures.... It also means I'm probably committed to doing a seascape at this point, a rolling seaway would be the best display option.....

 

If you can't fix it, hide it..... (and reminds us that even as good a kit this is none of them are perfect, they all have their issues)

 

EG

 

[Landlubber Mike]

Crap, sorry to see that.  Sounds like you have a plan forward though.

 

This is me just speaking out loud, but can you correct it with a hair dryer, or adding an understructure that pulls things into the correct shape and epoxying it all together?  

[Egilman]

31 minutes ago, Landlubber Mike said:

Crap, sorry to see that.  Sounds like you have a plan forward though.

 

This is me just speaking out loud, but can you correct it with a hair dryer, or adding an understructure that pulls things into the correct shape and epoxying it all together?  

Actually, this is what it corrected to, I used a heat gun very judiciously with weights to relieve some of the stress..... It's about half of what it was....

 

If I go much farther I'm afraid of cracking the upper hull in the middle.... Right now it pulls down good and leaves a nice smooth, mostly even seam along the waterline.... once I paint the boot topping and put it in the seaway it will hide any residuals...

 

There isn't enough room underneath to add any structure unless it's metal, I think I'll be better off welding it together and letting the plastic take the shape it wants to as long as no twist develops... The seaway it's going to be sitting in has an 8-10' swell that should cover any residuals.....

 

Thanks for the suggestions.....

[Old Collingwood]

Glad you have a plan that will sort that little headache brother,    by the way I can see the decs on the deck  - they are a nice addition to give it some detail, and better than trying to mask and paint them.

 

OC.

[Egilman]

Phew!!! Made it through that one.....

The hull halves and decks are glued together... Doesn't appear that any twist developed....

 

Now I get a bit of cleanup and all those tiny fiddly bits that make up the deck furniture, bits, bollards, winches, turret rings and such.... They need to be installed so they are out of the way

 

Onwards.....

[Old Collingwood]

Thats good progress  thare  - and good to see  both top and bottom hulls went together ok.

 

OC.

[Landlubber Mike]

Congrats man!  I love it when a plan comes together...

 

[Egilman]

Well, the fun has begun....

 

This is not my childhood model.... Dressing out the bow with the little, AND I MEAN LITTLE, parts and pieces is taking longer than I thought it would....

 

Each one of those bits on the deck are less than an eighth inch long six of them in that little space......

Closed sheaves...... (no more than a 32nd inch high)

I remember when they molded these parts on the hull edge and all you had to do is clean them......

 

I can certainly see why 1/200 scale is popular..... a lot has changed over the last few decades....

 

Onward....

Edited December 14, 2020 by Egilman

[lmagna]

If you think that was interesting just wait until you tackle the PE AA guns. You should have real fun with that.

[Egilman]

Alright! In the teaching an old dog new tricks department.....

 

Handling PE and the newer models with their tiny parts involves new techniques of assembly... I haven't done any PE on a ship model since my USS Olympia build of some 20ish years ago.... there was Toms MW and GMM and Eduard was still an upstart from europe concentrating on airplanes... the only way to glue PE was superglue and accelerator.... the parts were big enough to handle with small tweezers or surgical forceps...... My, have times changed, the parts are a lot smaller and PE has become much more refined and delicate...

 

This requires new techniques and materials to do it effectively......

 

So back to the research, (that is my second hobby) and I've found a few sources on the most effective way to install PE on models.... And surprisingly, Greg's method of installing first and painting afterwards is actually the most widely used today..... Back in the past you usually painted first and then formed and installed, touching up the paint afterwards, not any more...... 

 

Nowadays it's install the surface details first then paint, fold first, then paint.... completely opposite from what I learned.... 

 

So in the effort to get with the program, I looked it up on the net and saw how easy they seem to make it out to be.... (yet to see if I can adapt to the new methods)

 

But the first part is finding something to reliably pick and hang onto the parts and PE when installing them, and a glue that allows you to adjust them before setting up but still setting up rather quickly without the need for accelerators... Also giving a strong enough bond so the parts don't fall off at the first bump...

 

So I picked up some Crystal FX positioner pencils and a Marvy Jewel Picker... the pencils are especially adept at picking up plastic parts, the the jewel picker at handling PE.....

The jewel picker is an actual tool with two different size sticky tips with covers, recommended by a few friends in Japan who happen to be avid 1/700 scale WWII ship modelers..... The pencils are recommended by most youtube video modelers... (in any scale)

 

The #1 consensus on which glue to use is Gator's Grip glue, talking with Kenny, (the guy who makes it) it was especially formulated specifically for PE and has since been adapted for tiny plastic parts.....

I have ordered both directly from Kenny and it appears to be the leading PE glue advocated by the youtubers.... (although superglue is still advocated widely as well as PVA white glue)

 

As soon as the glue arrives I'll be assembling the deck furniture and will be giving Greg's technique of installing first then painting a shot....

 

Makes me feel like a beginner all over again....

Edited December 17, 2020 by Egilman

[RGL]

U-Star tweezers are my go to. Hands down the best tool I use, I very rarely use the pencils and I find a normal lead (graphite) pencil licked by tongue  is just as good as your got a sharper point this easier to see and that brings on my final necessity these days, and optivisor! 

Edited December 16, 2020 by RGL

[king derelict]

We use beeswax at work to hold a bolt on a socket when it needs to be installed in a tricky spot on an engine. It reduces the risk of the dreadful rattle, rattle , now how do we get it out again. Some of the beeswax seems to have come home with me ( it's cheap on Amazon too) and I use small balls on cocktail sticks or skewers. It great for gently picking up dropped PE not that anyone does that. I like the Gators Grip glue a lot. It retains a bit of flexibility when dry so PE is less likely to ping off of it gets touched later. Earlier this year after getting hit by two hurricanes his website said he was giving up on making it but I'm very happy to see he has resumed the blue business. The water clean up helps after placement of the part.

Alan

[Egilman]

41 minutes ago, king derelict said:

Earlier this year after getting hit by two hurricanes his website said he was giving up on making it but I'm very happy to see he has resumed the blue business.

He's actually quit making paint masks, when the residual is gone from his site, that's it, he's still producing the glue though.....  If anyone want's some, buy direct, it's cheaper.....

[Canute]

EG, what's his link/address?