Some silkspan tips

[wmherbert]

I'm a fan of sails on my models. I've been using silkspan and I thought I would pass along a few things I've learned.

      My models have been mostly schooners at 1:48 scale. One had sails furled , the rest set flying.

About 7 total. 

     I basically follow Tom Laurie's video with a few modifications.

    It is extremely hard to remix a new batch of paint to match what you originally used if you need more.  So what I did was to get the color I wanted, painted it on some silk span and then took it to home depot and had them color match it and the make up one of their small sample jars. It's not expensive and I can get more made up when ever I want and sails all match and I waste less paint.

      I use a 50 50 mix of PVA and water to brush on where I'm laying the edge strips and then lay the strips down and smooth out with my finger. I don't use his iron method.  Then when dry I gave each sail a quick ironing to smooth out the puckers that happened when they dried.

    I also use a little mat knife with break off tips to do all the cutting so I can keep a really sharp edge.

    I draw on the silk span with a #6 pencil that I keep with a sharp tip using sand paper.  I have a portable drafting board that makes drawing the many panel lines easy.  it is easy to get small tears in the paper. So always paint more silk span than you need. To trace the lines on the other side I tape the sail to a window and then trace over the lines from the other side.

     I'm sure others here have some other ideas but this has what helped me.

     Silkspan sails I think look better than cloth and are really not hard to do. So don't be afraid to give them a try.

Bill

[Gaffrig]

Hello.

 

I tried this on my model the Henriette Marie, and it worked out great!

Sails turned out more realistic than cloth in my opinion.

Will definetly use this method on my next model with sails.

(see gallery for more pictures)

 

Gaffrig.

[Snug Harbor Johnny]

  'Looks like your Bluenose in the background is coming along nicely!   ...   Love it !

[Gaffrig]

35 minutes ago, Snug Harbor Johnny said:

Looks like your Bluenose in the background is coming along nicely!   ...   Love it !

Thank you!

The truth is it’s been on hold for quite some time..

Gaffrig

[Dr PR]

I used silkspan for sails on my current model. It was the first time I have worked with silkspan and it was very easy. I followed Tom Lauria's procedure mostly. I used a small quilting iron to iron the tablings and linings, and to iron the entire sail after everything dried. It can also be used for plank bending!

 

https://modelshipworld.com/topic/19611-albatros-by-dr-pr-mantua-scale-148-revenue-cutter-kitbash-about-1815/?do=findComment&comment=1039363

 

[ERS Rich]

On 8/19/2024 at 12:44 PM, Gaffrig said:

I tried this on my model the Henriette Marie, and it worked out great!

What a handsome model.  Have same, without sails, this is inspiration to give the sails a try.  Thank you.

[wmherbert]

Here's my Henriette Marie also.

I kept track. kit took 30 hours total. Making sails took 3 hours. About another 1.5 hours installing them.

It is a pretty simple kit but sails really don't take very long. 

Definitely worth trying if you never have. Remember they are "sail" boats. Haha

Bill

[hollowneck]

On 8/19/2024 at 12:33 PM, wmherbert said:

Silkspan sails I think look better than cloth and are really not hard to do. So don't be afraid to give them a try.

Bravo. Your Henriette Marie looks very good, a convincing rendition. I employ a slightly different implementation than Mr. Laurie's, but use the same material.

[AJohnson]

I’m also experimenting with tissue paper sails on my current build, using similar methods to those detailed above. The only change I’m working on is simulating the sails panels with strips cut to scale and glued to both sides of a carrier sheet also of the same tissue paper. 
Currently testing out staining the tissue first verses painting the sails afterwards. The picture is of the painted version. I will update progress on my Trial log when I get time. 

[wmherbert]

Ajohnson the painted sail looks really nice. Much more of a weathered realistic look than I've managed. Mine have turned out more like slightly new sails. I think I will try to mottle a little color into my next ones.

    Using panels glued to a carrier sheet is a really interesting idea.  Did you eliminate the pencil lines?

Bill

[AJohnson]

I didn’t actually mark the tissue paper with pencil, I just lined the panels up by eye, so no cleanup of pencil marks needed. I am waiting on the stained sheets (using tea) to dry before making another sail for comparison then decide on which I prefer. 

Edited August 24 by AJohnson

[druxey]

May I suggest not using tea? It is acidic and will eventually make the material brittle and crumble. A wash of either watercolor or acrylic paint is a much better choice.

 

Andrew's sail ( Post #9) looks terrific!

Edited August 24 by druxey

[Dr PR]

Andrew's sail does look very realistic! Nice work.

 

I have given some thought to creating sails from strips of silkspan glued together, but it seems like a lot of work. However, it might produce more realistic sails than just penciling in lines.

 

Gluing silkspan strips together with a 50:50 water to glue mixture is very easy. I use the little quilting iron to quick dry the glue.

[AJohnson]

I glued them on the backing sheet with a glue stick! Those ones that you twist to extend, sorry, I know I should leave the kids craft stuff alone. 😂

[wmherbert]

I hadn't thought about clue sticks. 

I think I will try cutting carrier piece to exact sail shape and gluing strips on. They alway start parallel to one edge. And then let run over other two sides and trim off after the side is done.

      Have you had any problem with the longevity of the glue stick?  Did you use glue stick for the narrow edge strip also?

Bill

[AJohnson]

52 minutes ago, wmherbert said:

I hadn't thought about clue sticks. 

I think I will try cutting carrier piece to exact sail shape and gluing strips on. They alway start parallel to one edge. And then let run over other two sides and trim off after the side is done.

      Have you had any problem with the longevity of the glue stick?  Did you use glue stick for the narrow edge strip also?

Bill

Hi Bill, the glue sticks are good in that they don’t get the tissue paper too wet so the wrinkles are not as bad as liquid glue. But I do use dilute fabric glue on some seams (gently brushed on with a small brush) that don’t hold if I haven’t got a good coverage with the glue stick. 
Yes I agree the hardest bit is keeping the strips straight, that tests my hand-eye coordination and my my patience! 😀

[hollowneck]

18 hours ago, druxey said:

A wash of either watercolor or acrylic paint is a much better choice.

 

Andrew's sail ( Post #9) looks terrific!

I agree, Andrew's sail looks great. In the attached, the Liquitex spray can and it's sister Liquitex soft body acrylic bottle - both in "unbleached titanium" color - are my go-to solution for approximating the color of working sail canvas.

[Jsk]

6 hours ago, AJohnson said:

I glued them on the backing sheet with a glue stick! Those ones that you twist to extend, sorry, I know I should leave the kids craft stuff alone. 😂

 

So if I understand this technique, the sail ends up being two thicknesses of silk span (three at the overlap seams)? The seams are on one side only but the sail is transparent enough so that you can see them on both sides?

[AJohnson]

10 minutes ago, Jsk said:

So if I understand this technique, the sail ends up being two thicknesses of silk span (three at the overlap seams)? The seams are on one side only but the sail is transparent enough so that you can see them on both sides?

The sail is three sheets thick (five at the overlaps), I put strips on both sides. It is five sheets thick where I add reinforcement or repair patches and the perimeter edge strip, this nicely changes the translucency of those panels which adds interest and stops the sail looking too uniform.  Hope that helps. 

One other thing I have learned in the last day or so cutting strips is you need new scalpel blades on a regular basis as the strips start to rip pretty quick. Then I remembered we have a rotary rule & cutter and that is much easier and quicker! With no tears due to dragging a slightly blunt blade.  😀

[Thukydides]

Those sails look fantastic Andrew, I really like the method you came up with. They really do give a lot of visual interest to the sails.

[wmherbert]

I just tried Andrew's method with a quick little sample using glue stick to experiment a little. It all went together quite easily.  Getting an even overlap is a little tricky on the first side but matching it on other side is easy. It's difficult to see in this photo showing the result versus the pencil line method but I think it does look more realistic.

    I think if you get into a production line making strips and have middle sheet cut to rough or exact sail size  it would go pretty fast.

Bill

[druxey]

An alternative to gluing up separate strips is to paint the overlaps of the cloths using acrylic paint and a ruling pen.

[wmherbert]

A very nice result as well. How did you keep a uniform width for the painted overlap?  

Here's about as good I can do with pencil lines on my current build. I will keep experimenting too since for me the sails make a lot of difference

Bill

[GGibson]

On 8/25/2024 at 12:29 PM, AJohnson said:

Then I remembered we have a rotary rule & cutter and that is much easier and quicker! With no tears due to dragging a slightly blunt blade.  😀

 

That's a sharp-looking tool. Andrew!! 😁 I may need a new tool! <shrug>

[druxey]

The uniform width of line is provided by the ruling pen. Its two blades are adjusted to the width apart of the overlap. The paint consistency needs to be experimented with for a smooth flow. Some practice is needed to get this right!

 

[Louie da fly]

I wish I'd seen Tom Lauria's videos before I started working with silkspan. He solves a lot of problems I encountered in using it, and his technique is much more systematic than mine - I felt I was having to re-invent the wheel a lot of the time, and though I'm not too unhappy with my results I feel they would have been far better had I seen the videos first.

 

And some of the tips on this thread have been real eye-openers for me as well. Thanks to everybody who's posted here. It's a great help and I'll be using what I've learned in future builds.

 

Steven

[AJohnson]

13 hours ago, wmherbert said:

A very nice result as well. How did you keep a uniform width for the painted overlap?  

Here's about as good I can do with pencil lines on my current build. I will keep experimenting too since for me the sails make a lot of difference

Bill

 

 

That looks really smart Bill. 
And thanks for starting this thread, loads of great conversations and tips I am going to try on future builds. 

[Thukydides]

16 hours ago, druxey said:

An alternative to gluing up separate strips is to paint the overlaps of the cloths using acrylic paint and a ruling pen.

 

So is this just a single sheet of silk span with more paint on certain parts?

[wmherbert]

I had to look up ruling pen. Never had heard of them. I guess you would paint the silkspan first and then mix a slightly darker color for the ruling pen. I assume painted on one side only?

Bill

[wefalck]

I have used silk-paper and silk-fabric (as used to 'span' model aircraft wings etc.) for decades. The first time I made the sails up from individual panels was in the mid to late 1990s, I think.

 

Below is the sequence for making some 'tanned' sails in 1:90 scale. Because the prototype sails were tanned with a mixture of tallow and ochre, I was not concerned about translucence:

A computer drawing (above) from which the individual panels were separated was taped to a board onto which the silk-paper was taped. The panels were then drawn onto the silk-paper and cut out with an allowance for the seams:

The original computer drawing was then taped to a board and covered in clingfilm. Onto this the first panel was taped and painted with a fast-drying varnish. The next panel was treated in the same way and so forth.

Then doublings etc were added and when complete the sail was removed and trimmed to size:

After this step the sail was returned to the clingfilm-covered drawing and lightly taped down so that the boltropes could be glued on:

Also cringles and other ropework was added:

In the final step, the sail was spray-painted to simulate the tanning:

This method works very well for set sails, but for gathered up sails and so on, there is risk that the glued seams open and also the various coats of varnish and paint make the rather stiff. 

Therefore, for my next project, where the untreated flax/hemp sails will be hanging limp for drying over stays and spars, I might try the method suggested by druxey.

The lining pens druxey uses were a standard feature of technical drawing sets. I got my drawing set when entering secondary school in 1967 and still have it. I remember trying to use it with enamels during my teenage years but that didn't work very well. I can imagine that with acrylics pre-diluted for spray-painting (e.g. my favourite Vallejo ModelAir) it will work very well.