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Posts posted by gjdale
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Thanks Bob and Kurt,
I copied Ken Foran on the email I sent to Model Expo yesterday and have had a reply already from him, confirming that some of the early kits did ship with the thicker walls - so I guess that confirms my suspicion (I can’t actually do a check measurement now that everything is built). Wish I’d done some extra research to discover this before I started building - I might have been able to get a replacement for the boiler walls.
Thanks also Kurt for you reply to my PM query and your advice, which aligns very much with Wefalck’s observations above.
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Thanks Wefalck for that insight. I think it must be the latter (pressure hose) that is meant to be simulated in this kit. If you look at the box art picture in the very first post, it shows the hoses flattened (two per side).
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Thanks Mark. I've just finished writing up a document with all of my observations on errors with parts and/or instructions and have forwarded that off to Model Expo. I've asked for a replacement for the hose material, so I'll see what they come back with.
And thanks Egilman for the link - some interesting discussion there and some food for thought about alternative material. Will wait and see what Model Expo have to say before deciding on the way forward.
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A number of small tasks remain to bring the model to completion.
Finishing Touches…..almost
First up was the installation of the brake pedal and spring mechanism. The spring joins the brake pedal to the seat. The other end of the brake pedal slips over the crossover bar that passes through the bottom of the water box. Once this is in place, the End Caps are added to either side of the crossover bar.
Then the forward Hose Brackets are added, with the lower ends (complete with faux bolts) attached to the forward end of the water box and aligned with its front edge.
The next task is to prepare the Head Lamp and Hand Lamp Lenses. These are provided as laser cut clear plastic pieces – four large round ones for the Head Lamp and one smaller round one and two rectangular ones for each of the two Hand Lamps. These all need to be shaped by adding a bevel to the outer edge of all the round lenses and shaping the rectangular lenses to match the contour of the sides of the Hand Lamps. My weapon of choice for this task was a series of sanding sticks. I recently discovered this product from Ultimate Modelling Products called “Thinny Sticks” and they are really good. The have a hard centre core with a softer foam on either side and then the sanding grit on top of that. They also have a shape that provides for a wider end for general work and a thinner end for smaller spaces. I find the shape to particularly good ergonomically too. Each stick has the same grit on both sides and the centre core is colour coded so it’s pretty hard to get mixed up as to which grit you are using. Having used them throughout this build, I can highly recommend them. The grits below are 240 / 400 / 800/ 1200 and then the larger one is a double-sided buffing stick, again colour coded for 3,000 and 12,000. The buffing sticks also come in the same size as the Thinny Sticks. Working through these grits on both the Britannia Metal and the clear plastic, I was able to achieve a mirror finish.
Here are the round lenses showing on the right after initial shaping with 240 grit and on the left after final buffing. I didn’t feel the need to go as far as polishing compound. The camera doesn’t do the final product justice!
And here are the rectangular lenses Two untouched lenses on the left, a shaped lens and then a finished lens on the right.
The Head Lamp lenses were then inserted into the Head Lamp (I used aircraft canopy glue for this to avoid fogging caused by CA), and the Head Lamp epoxied in place on top of the Large Expansion Tank.
The Large Expansion Tank was then epoxied in place on its supporting bracket. (The whip holder and whip were also added around this time).
And here are the Hand Lamps temporarily installed. They won’t be fixed in place until the model is finally completed.
The Spark Arrestor was then added to the Smoke Stack Section and the Smoke Stack Top added to that.
The Boiler Top was then added to the Boiler Cap Ring:
And the Smoke Stack assembly placed atop that:
An almost final task was to add the tires. These are provided as laser cut gasket strips. After cutting the free from the carrier sheet, they only need a light swipe with a 240 grit Thinny Stick to remove the remains of the connecting nubs and then gluing in place around the rims of each wheel. The wheels were removed one at a time for this and the task proved much easier than I first imagined it would be. Once the wheels were replaced, the hub caps were added.
At this point, I discovered yet another disappointing quality control issue with the provided kit material – the Fire Hoses. These are supposed to be provided in the form of tubular shoelaces. The idea is that the end of the shoelace is opened up to insert the Hose Nozzles before shaping the hoses and attaching them to the model. A neat idea, except that the kit provided shoelaces are not tubular – they are flat, with nothing to open up for the nozzles. This is another of those extremely frustrating and totally unnecessary errors on the part of Model Expo. I now can’t finish the model until I source some sort of suitable replacement, either from Model Expo or elsewhere. I’m also still waiting on the delivery of the part I need to complete the Boiler Water Level Gauge – held up in the postal system at the moment.
Other than these two items, the model is complete. I can do nothing now except wait for replacement parts to finish this off. In the meantime, here are some overview pics. I’ll save the final “glam” shots until the model is finally complete.
I'll be back when I have some more finishing touches.....
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Looking fabulous Kevin - you are sneaking up on the finish line!
- Old Collingwood, Kevin, mtaylor and 2 others
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Wefalck,
If you follow this link,
it will take you to Ken’s build of the prototype in brass. Within that log are many pictures of the original, which is in a museum very near to Ken’s home. Towards the end of that log, he shows a test build of the production parts that were cast from his original. In reviewing that log, I saw at the end that a couple of people had found some of the same issues I have had with the kit. Prime among them was forming the boiler walls. Apparently the design was changed and the wall thickness halved - I think I must have an early production kit though with the thicker walls (I did buy this kit as soon as it was released back in 2014).
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1 hour ago, wefalck said:
Are there no water gauges at the stoking platform ?
Apparently not Wefalck. As I mentioned in an earlier post, I believe that the kit designer (Ken Foran) was very faithful to the original, to which he had access.
- Canute, mtaylor, Old Collingwood and 4 others
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Another successful day at the “Fire Station” today, with no major issues encountered - for a change! 😊
First up today was to add the Steam Regulator. There was some fettling to do to fit this as the shaft that goes to the Boiler is deliberately left long and needs to be filed back to make a snug fit against the Boiler wall. The Adjustment Arm (on the right in the picture below) is attached to the Adjustment Arm Link (which was installed way back when the Flywheel assembly was added to the Main Frame) with a 00-90 Bolt and Nut. Some dexterity challenges again, but no major drama.
Now we start to fill in all those holes in the Boiler Wall, starting with the Rear Boiler Wall. First up, the Boiler Grab Bar:
Next is the engraved Boiler Shield and the Brackets for the upper end of the Hose Nozzles.
The Nozzles are now fitted.
And that completes the Rear Boiler Wall.
Now we continue with the Frame Parts, starting with the Water Return Pipes. There is one of these on each side. They are indexed into the lower hole in the side of the manifold, while the other end is simply glued to the face of the Boiler wall.
Now the Flywheel Arm and Links are added. Again, there are two of these, and each is comprised of two parts that index together before being glued using the locating pins – one end to the Flywheel shaft, the other to the upper hole in the side of the manifold.
I departed a little from the sequence in the instruction manual, only because I thought that access might be easier for some of the parts. So next up, I fitted the Pressure Release Valve – it goes very close to the Steam Regulator.
Then it was the Rear Hose Brackets and the Hand Lamp Holders:
A series of four Valves are now added, taking care to align the angle of the drain spouts (pointing down and to the left).
And then the Boiler Pressure Gauge is added:
The Steam Whistle is next:
And then the Frame to Boiler Braces. It’s a little hard to see in this photo but the Brace is the diagonal Red bar going from top right of the picture where it attaches to the Frame, to the bottom left where it attaches to the Boiler wall.
We now move our attention forward and install the Small Expansion Tank:
And then we add the Large Expansion Tank Support and the Seat. These are a little tricky as the Support is indexed into a hole in the Seat and the Seat Legs index into holes in the front of the Water Box. Because these parts will carry the weight of the Large Expansion Tank, they are glued with 5-min epoxy.
And finally, here is an overall shot of where we are at as of close of play today.
Still a way to go yet, but we are closing in on the finish line.
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That’s interesting Wefalck. Given that the instructions for painting these parts called for them to “leather brown”, I’m guessing that they were indeed a stack of leather discs as you noted.
When Ken Foran (Xken here at MSW) designed this model, he had full access to the preserved original. I’m pretty sure his design is faithful to that original.
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A successful day at the “Fire Station” today, although not without it’s challenges.
The Brake System
The next step is the installation of the Brake System. Here are all the component parts:
We start by removing the wheels, propping up the main frame and front axle, and inserting the Brake Crossover Bar (second from left in the above picture) through the holes in the bottom of the Water Box. These were test fitted when the parts were being painted, so no unwelcome surprises here.
We then take connect the Brake U-link to the Brake Link using a pair of 0-80 nuts on the threaded end of the Brake Link. These will be used later on to adjust the length of the Brake Link.
The U-link is then connected to the Brake Crossover Bar on the right-hand side of the vehicle using a 0-80 x 1/4” bolt from the inside and securing with a 0-80 nut on the outside. Then we add the Crossover Bar Link on the left-hand side of the Crossover Bar and repeat the connection to the U-Link. Not particularly difficult, though something of a dexterity test.
We now need to install the Brake Lever Pivot Arms, Pivot Arm Braces, and the Brake Lever Arms. The Pivot Arms and Braces form a triangle that is bolted to the boiler wall using 00-90 bolts and nuts. They are positioned toward the bottom of the boiler. In this photo, you can see the length of reach required inside the boiler to be able to attach the nuts.
Here I decided to depart from the instructions and carefully inverted the entire model so that it sat on the boiler cap ring and was supported at the front end of the water box. This allowed me to access the bolts from the underneath of the boiler. I retained this position for the remainder of the installation. Here is the triangular bracing in place, along with the Brake Lever Arm.
Once both Brake Lever Arm assemblies had been attached, we are instructed to add the Brake U-connector to join both Brake Lever Arms to the Brake Link using 0-80 x 1/4" Bolts and Nuts. One problem with that…..the 1/4" bolts are not long enough for the job, as seen in this photo.
I had a dig through my leftover bits and pieces from my Pocher car build and found some suitable alternatives. They were slighter larger in diameter at 2mm, so I had to re-drill all the holes, which in turn meant dis-assembling some of what I’d already assembled. Here is the result:
While the bolts may now be a little too long, I’m not going to worry about cutting them shorter as they can’t be seen that well anyway. At this point, the misalignment issues discovered earlier came back to play and a little judicious bending of the brake arm assemblies was required.
The Main Drain was also inserted while the wheels were off. The pre-drilled hole in the boiler wall was a little too low for it to sit correctly, so I elongated the hole somewhat with a small needle file until I could get it to sit correctly.
The wheels were put on, at which point we find another error in the Bill of Parts. The wheels are held on with 1-72 nuts. The parts list indicates that 8 of these are supplied and indeed that is what was in the kit. Only problem is, 9 are required to build the model. By happy coincidence, the replacement nuts I used for the U-connector were just the right size to fit on the axle stub I had previously broken and re-glued. The remaining provided nuts all went on to the cast threads without issue.
Here is an overall shot of where we are at today:
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Love the home-made tools! Great addition and well done.
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7 hours ago, BobG said:
Thanks for stopping by and giving me a little nudge!
Happy to be of service my friend! 😉
And a belated Happy 75th
- BobG and Ryland Craze
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Nice progress Mark - must feel good to reach that particular milestone.
- Edwardkenway, mtaylor, Jack12477 and 2 others
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Thanks again for all the input (and also for the "likes" following along). A somewhat frustrating day in the workshop today.
What the…?
Prior to tackling the Brake System, the instructions call for three small jobs to be done: finishing the Hoze Nozzles, constructing the Boiler Water Level Sight Gauge, and making the Brake Spring. All three should be simple, straight forward tasks. All three had issues…
Hose Nozzles
The instructions call for wrapping the Hose Nozzles in the rather nice red thread provided using a Common Whipping. We are advised to take a 36” piece of the thread for each Nozzle to do this. I cut the thread in half and noted that each half was very slightly longer than the prescribed 36”. Good, I thought… Then I discovered that no matter how frugal I was in allowing for the ends and the loop, there was no way that a 36” piece of thread was going to cover the entire Hose Nozzle. After some experimentation and a lot of cursing, I managed to make it cover all bar about 3-4mm at the handle end. Why Model Expo couldn’t have made the supplied thread a couple of inches longer is beyond me. It is not something that I can duck out to a local store to replace either. Very annoyed by this totally unnecessary error.
Anyway, here is a picture of in progress showing one Nozzle wrapped and the other pre-wrapping.
And here they are completed. You can see in the photo where the wrapping stops short of the handles. It should go all the way to the handles per the instructions and included photos.
Boiler Water Level Sight Gauge
The Boiler Water Level Sight Gauge is made of a top and bottom cast part, four connecting brass rods and a clear plastic rod. Here are the parts laid out (and yes, one of the top/bottom parts is facing the wrong way). It’s quite a clever construction design, but …
The issue here is the diameter of the clear plastic rod. The parts list in the written instructions for this component call for a 3/32” diameter rod. The separate drawing sheet for the clear plastic components calls it out as 0.0625” (1/16”). The part that is provided is 1/16”. The recesses in the cast components are sized to accept 3/32” (as confirmed by test fitting a piece of 3/32” brass rod I had on hand). Really guys? What happened to proof reading and quality control? The most frustrating thing about this error is that I don’t have stocks of clear plastic rod to hand. Using the provided 1/16” rod is a non-starter as it will both look wrong and be difficult to actually construct. I have managed to track some down of the right size through one of my ‘go-to’ Hobby Stores, but it is costing me $10 for a pack of 5 rods, each of 250 mm length (I need one piece 25 mm in length), and then it’s costing me another $14 in postage and a wait of about a week or so. Again, totally unnecessary and very frustrating.
Brake Spring
The instructions call for you to make the Brake Spring from the provided wire. A simple enough task – what could possibly go wrong?
Well, first up, the instructions for this appear in two places in the instruction manual – once on pg 25 and again on pg 42. And these instructions are actually different to each other! On pg 25 it calls for using a piece of 28g brass wire and on pg 42 it calls for using 0.020 brass wire. Well, I looked up some tables and 28g is 0.0126”, while 0.020” is 24g. What is provided in the kit is 0.015” which is equates to somewhere between 26g and 27g. It would appear that the instructions were revised at one stage and one version of this section should have been removed but wasn’t. At least they could have provided the right size wire for one set of instructions instead of neither! At least this was an easy fix.
The kit provided wire felt a little too thin for the purpose, so I dug through my stash and found some 24g Copper Wire. The advantage of using the Copper Wire is that instead of painting it black, I was able to chemically blacken it with Liver of Sulphur. The technique is dead easy – just insert a 1/16” drill bit in a pin vise with the smooth end sticking our about 3/4” and then wrap the wire around the drill bit. Form a couple of “U” hooks on the end and job done. Here is the result, test fitted between the Seat and the Brake Pedal Arm.
Okay – now I’m ready to tackle the Brake Sysem…
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On 9/10/2021 at 1:43 AM, BobG said:
I'm afraid this is going to be slow going for a while while I figure things out as I go along and I'm thinking of starting another build to fill in the gaps and add some variety to my modeling at the same time.
Hey Bob, any progress on this beauty lately? Or did you start another build that you are keeping from us?
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Thanks for the input and suggestions Ron and Egilman. Noting Egilman’s comment on thread chasing, I think Ron’s suggestion is the safest way to go. I think then that I won’t mess about. If the nuts don’t go on nice and easily (as they did on one side of the front axle), I’ll drill out the nuts and glue them on. Once they are on, they won’t be under any strain, so a spot of CA should be fine to hold them.
Thanks again for the input everyone - one of the many things I love about this forum! 😊
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Thanks Wefalck. That’s an interesting point you make about ‘joggling’ the joint - I think I understand what you mean and it makes a lot of sense. It would certainly address the issue of alignment. However, the instructions (including photos) say to do it the way I have. Would be really interesting to try though…. Perhaps the next person to tackle this kit can try that approach - I’d certainly love to see it done that way.
I’ve been wondering about the possibility of chasing the threads on the cast parts, but I’m not convinced the metal would stand up to even that amount of torsional force. I’ll dig around in the tool chest this week and see if I have a 00-90 die and if so, might give it a try. What could possibly go wrong? Worst case is I break the thread just the same as if I just try to put the nut on without first chasing it wth the die.
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Rear Axle
Next up is the gathering of parts for assembly of the Rear Axle. This includes the previously painted parts plus some 00-90 nuts and bolts.
First up, the Rear Axle is mounted with it’s support shaft inserted through the hole in the lower boiler wall and the Rear Axle Lock (the unpainted disc in the above picture) inserted from inside the boiler and glued in place. Not too difficult, except being able to reach down inside the boiler from above to place the Lock.
The next step is fitting the Shock Absorbers and their vertical and horizontal braces, as well as the Coal Bin Braces. While the horizontal braces only have a locating pin to place in the respective hole in the boiler wall, both the vertical braces and the coal bin braces are attached with 00-90 nuts and bolts, with the nuts being secured on the inside of the boiler. While the dexterity required to attach these little critters is quite challenging in itself, the real problem is a matter of alignment.
Even though I had been meticulous in my forming of and placement of the boiler walls, I found that things just wouldn’t align quite properly. I can only conclude that either the boiler walls weren’t pre drilled in the correct place, or the design did not allow for the additional thickness of the boiler walls where they overlap, which in turn reduces the outer diameter of the boiler in order for it to fit within the boiler and main frame rings. Whatever the cause (and I don’t think it’s operator error), the result is that the shock absorbers don’t sit quite vertically, and in order to make the coal bin braces align with the respective holes in the boiler wall, a significant twist is imparted to the coal bin floor. This photo shows the extent of that twist.
The good news is that the model is normally viewed from the side, so the twist isn’t really evident from that angle, and the rear wheels obscure the shock absorbers to the extent that their misalignment becomes largely unnoticeable as well. Nevertheless, it was disappointing to have come this far in the build, only to encounter this issue.
Having decided that there was absolutely nothing I could do to correct this issue, I pushed on. Next up was adding the Rear Axle Links and Hooks. These are simply attached with CA glue to the Shock Absorber bracket and Boiler wall.
Front Axle Brace
The Front Axle Brace now gets attached to the Front Boiler Wall. This is achieved by placing a 1-72 nut on the threaded end of the Brace, either side of the Chain Attachment Bracket and the Brace Plate. The two nuts are then used to adjust the ‘length’ of the brace such that the Attachment Bracket sits flush against the Boiler wall, where it is glued in place with CA glue.
Chains
Two lengths of Chain were used to limit the travel of front axle and prevent the rim hitting the main frame. The instructions say to cut two lengths of Chain 4 7/8” (98mm) long. Ummmm 98mm is 3 7/8”…. So which is it? As it turns out, neither measurement is correct. I started with the longer length (4 7/8”) and after placing the first one could see that it was way too long. I adjusted it visually so that the chain was doing what it was supposed to do, and then cut it to length – which turned out to be 4 1/8”. The jump rings still need a little touch up of the red paint here.
While I was in that vicinity, I decided to add the Centre Pressure Release Valve as I could not find any further reference to it in the instructions. It took me a while to find it on the drawings too. I could just make it out in some other reference photos later in the instructions, but only as an ‘incidental’ to what the photo was illustrating. As it’s quite a difficult place to get to, I figured installing it now was probably a smart move.
Rear Wheels
The Rear Wheels are slipped temporarily in place on the Rear Axle. As these will be removed several times yet, I decided to heed the instructions and not try to fit the securing nuts for fear of breaking another axle.
The Rear Axle Guide, Boiler Coal Door and Door Latch were added a little earlier, but I forgot to take a picture at the time. Here they are in place too:
A little diversion now while I attend to the wrappings for the Hose Nozzles and also make up the Boiler Water Level Sight Gauge, before returning to my most dreaded task - installing the Brake System...
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Thanks Mark. It's not the nuts and bolts that are Britannia metal (they are brass) - it's the threads on the axles and shafts that are the problematic Britannia metal.
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Assembly Commences…
As it happens, the extra Red paint turned up the day after my last post, along with the replacement chain I had ordered.
The wheel painting was then able to be completed. I gave them all a coat of Alclad Klear Kote Light Sheen and a light touch with a 1200 grit sanding stick. The hubcaps were all test fitted for a nice press fit.
I also painted the new chain while I was at it. I’m very happy with the size of this chain – it looks “about right” when overlaid on the 1:1 scale drawings. Here it is alongside the kit-supplied chain for comparison.
And with that, all painting (other than touch-ups) is completed. Assembly can now commence.
Front Axle Assembly
The first step in assembly is the installation of the front axle. To this, the previously completed main frame sub-assembly was carefully turned upside down and the Front Axle placed over the Pivot Shaft.
The Front Axle Brace is then slipped into place and secured with a 1-72 nut.
I worry every time I have to place a nut onto a thread on a cast part. This Britannia metal is so soft that the slightest torsion will cause the part to break as I was about to find out – again…
The Front Wheels are then temporarily installed.
As the Front Wheels will need to be removed later to add the Brake Linkage, the instructions simply advise to be careful that they don’t inadvertently come off and cause damage. I thought that was a recipe for disaster, so decided to temporarily add the retaining washers and 1-72 nuts onto the threaded ends. One side went on beautifully. The other proved my point about the softness of the Britannia metal. I was being as gentle as I could possibly be, but the thread was not cast perfectly and with just a slight amount of pressure, the thread broke. I have re-attached the broken part for now with CA glue, but will need to find a permanent solution once the Brake Linkage has been installed.
Boiler Walls
The lower boiler wall – formed way back as the very first stage of construction – is now attached to the Coal Bin. Alignment is critical here and the instructions guide you to align the centre of the rear axle support shaft hole in the boiler wall with the centre rivet in the Coal Bin floor joint. The Boiler Top Ring is temporarily added as a sizing fixture and brace. Once satisfied with the alignment, we are instructed to glue the boiler wall in place from the inside using CA glue and once set, to reinforce with 5-minute epoxy, also adding epoxy to the vertical joint in the boiler wall as further reinforcement for that joint. All I can say is, easier said than done! The boiler wall sits on a very narrow ledge and it is very difficult to get glue in place. I can see that this will be even more tricky once we get to attach the top of the lower boiler wall to the main frame…
At this point, the hole for the Rear Axle Support Shaft has to be re-drilled through the inner wall (where the two ends of the boiler wall overlap. That also proved quite tricky and resulted in me having to subsequently re-attach the boiler wall to to the Coal Bin…
The instructions stress the importance of aligning correctly the Coal Bin and the Main Frame, ensuring that the sides of each are parallel. The suggested method is to temporarily clamp some scrap pieces of stock to the sides of the coal bin to assist the visual alignment. Great in theory, but neglects the fact that the sides of the Coal Bin are not perpendicular to the axis of the main frame. In this overhead shot, you can clearly see the taper from rear to front.
Nevertheless, the same result can be achieved by “middling” the gaps and trying to ensure an even taper on both sides. Once that is achieved, the coal bin is first glued with CA to the Main Frame Boiler Ring, and then followed up with 5-min Epoxy. This proved again to be quite a tricky process as one needs to reach over and up under the upper rim to place the glue on the inside of the joint. Fortunately, the insides of the boiler will never be seen, so neatness is not a requirement!
Once the Epoxy had set, it was time to add the upper boiler. Again, the instructions stress the importance of aligning the two boiler walls by aligning the line of rivets at the join in the walls. The Boiler Top Ring is again used as a steadying and forming aid to maintain the shape as the lower edge is fitted into the Main Frame ring. Here you can see the upper boiler in place and aligned with the lower boiler. You can also see in this photo the hole for the Rear Axle Support shaft after re-drilling in the previous step.
Once again, both top and bottom joints are glued with CA and followed up with 5-min Epoxy. This was even trickier than gluing the lower boiler and the use of long bamboo skewers proved to be an excellent choice of gluing aid. Once set, the instructions ask you to dry fit and then glue in place the Boiler Cap Ring. Once I dry-fitted mine, the fit was so snug that getting it out again to place some glue was proving to be problematic. In the end, I decided that the fit was so snug, that glue wasn’t going to be necessary. Here is the result.
More to follow shortly....
Old Member Introduction
in New member Introductions
Posted
Hey Bug! Great to see you back my friend. I look forward to following your next build.