Honda RC166 Grand Prix Racer by CDW - FINISHED - Tamiya - 1/12

[CDW]

As soon as I finish my current ship build, the USS Essex CV-9, I plan to build this 1:12 scale Tamiya Honda 250cc Grand Prix Racer.

The model as depicted represents the 1966 World Champion who won 10 out of 10 races held that year.

The stock model kit is quite a well detailed offering from Tamiya. But to satisfy my OCD, will add super detailing parts just to make certain I keep things as complicated as possible. 

 

 

 

The detail parts include an updated, fully detailed front fork assembly; a detailed metal link-by-link drive chain and sprockets (with an assembly jig); a set of microscopic rivets; and last but not least, a fully detailed set of metal spokes, rims, and hubs, along with an appropriate jig to assemble it all and lace the wire spokes.

 

 

I can hardly wait, and it gives me motivation to get my Essex finished, soon! 

Edited May 15, 2023 by CDW

[Keith_W]

I can't wait either! I will be following this. 

[CDW]

It’s only been seven years since I last worked on it but I plan to resurrect this build to finish it once my Buccaneer (current project) is completed. 😀

Edited April 17, 2023 by CDW

[DocRob]

On 12/18/2016 at 8:55 PM, CDW said:

I can hardly wait, and it gives me motivation to get my Essex finished, soon! 

 

Me neither, I have the same kit and extras and it itched me sometimes to start the Honda. I will follow your build and take place on the sparse (non existent in fact) back seat.

 

Cheers Rob

[shipman]

Sitting upright in excited anticipation.

The Tamiya m/c kits are lovely little things.

To do these faired bikes justice you really need to build two, faired and without.

[CDW]

37 minutes ago, shipman said:

Sitting upright in excited anticipation.

The Tamiya m/c kits are lovely little things.

To do these faired bikes justice you really need to build two, faired and without.

I agree. Seems a shame covering up all that detail with a fairing.

[CDW]

Somewhere back when, I failed to keep progress photos of the frame and engine construction but here is where it stands as of today. 

Edited April 21, 2023 by CDW

[CDW]

I started the spoked wheel/s construction as outlined here:

 

This is the beginning of lacing the rear wheel and where I will resume progress photos in the future:

 

[shipman]

The real thing was virtually a model it's self. Imagine 6 these things thrashing around at 20,000 rpm!

Edited April 21, 2023 by shipman
Missing photo

[CDW]

Looks like it had a hefty crank to handle all those RPM's.

[Egilman]

Probably a billet crank, relieved, shot peened and magnafluxed, as light as possible...

 

Brother built a 250 cafe racer, everything you could conceive of went into it, it was quick when he bought it...

 

When he was done, he hit it in a parking lot and promptly spun the rear tire off the rim... Had the tires bolted to the rims...

 

He eventually learned to ride it, 0-135 in 8 seconds... Had it for two years then sold it cause he realized that he would eventually kill himself on it... It was perfect not a scratch or ding...

The guy he sold it too promptly flipped it onto its back when trying to take off on it... It didn't need much throttle to take off...

 

Man, those were the crazy days...

Edited April 21, 2023 by Egilman

[Old Collingwood]

"Wheel  Lacing"    remember those days  -  not  with motor cycles  but  bicycles,  I built a  few  years back.

 

OC.

[shipman]

No, the crank was a pressed up affair. In fact if you picked it up off the bench without support, it actually sagged!

The crank cases and main bearings are what gave it rigidity.

A mechanic was asked to lift one of these engines onto a work bench. It was so light he assumed there were no internals...until it was opened up!

The engine had no flywheel effect and had to be run at no less than 2,000rpm, or it just died.

As this project develops, I'll find some references (if you're interested), to illustrate I'm not exaggerating.

Edited April 21, 2023 by shipman
missing bracket

[CDW]

46 minutes ago, shipman said:

No, the crank was a pressed up affair. In fact if you picked it up off the bench without support, it actually sagged!

The crank cases and main bearings are what gave it rigidity.

A mechanic was asked to lift one of these engines onto a work bench. It was so light he assumed there were no internals...until it was opened up!

The engine had no flywheel effect and had to be run at no less than 2,000rpm, or it just died.

As this project develops, I'll find some references (if you're interested), to illustrate I'm not exaggerating.

If you get the chance, I would love to see photos of the engine internals. I knew it was a special crank when I saw the connecting rod. You'll see connecting rods like this in model airplane engines that turn tens of thousands RPM's.

[VitusBering]

I took one of these apart because a hard landing in mud goobered up the innards. It doesn't have reference marks for rocker and valve timing so I couldn't get it back together right after dozens of tries.

 

I put the hundreds of parts in a bag and took it to my flying club meeting. Those ever-so-helpful folks gathered around, clucked their tongues and, to a man, said "you poor b*****d". I sent it off to Saito and they re-assembled it at no charge aside from shipping.

 

 

The only thing I can find to illustrate the small scale is a video.

 

[Egilman]

1 hour ago, shipman said:

No, the crank was a pressed up affair. In fact if you picked it up off the bench without support, it actually sagged!

Yep, that what was in my brother's bike when he bought it, he replaced it with a speed shop custom crank, lighter and stronger...

[CDW]

5 hours ago, VitusBering said:

I took one of these apart because a hard landing in mud goobered up the innards. It doesn't have reference marks for rocker and valve timing so I couldn't get it back together right after dozens of tries.

 

I put the hundreds of parts in a bag and took it to my flying club meeting. Those ever-so-helpful folks gathered around, clucked their tongues and, to a man, said "you poor b*****d". I sent it off to Saito and they re-assembled it at no charge aside from shipping.

 

 

The only thing I can find to illustrate the small scale is a video.

 

I owned this O.S. 1.20 twin that I bought from a fellow 2nd hand. After I bought it from him, learned that he had accidentally amputated his thumb when the prop struck it.

 

I never disassembled one of my twins. I also owned this Saito 2.70 twin.

 

 

But I have disassembled, repaired and rebuilt several four stroke singles, Enya's, Saito's and O.S.'s. Valve timing is a thing.

[shipman]

Here's a Japanese TV program where you get to see nearly every nut, bolt and washer of the engine being stripped in front of a live audience. I don't know of an English dubbed version, but this is a MUST SEE for anyone interested.

 

[CDW]

It all comes back to my recollection now as to why I stopped construction of this little project: it’s all about lacing the wire wheel spokes. In the top of the photo is a tiny paint tin filled with little machined nipples. These must be slid into holes in the rims to capture each spoke. It takes the patience of Job to get this done. I think I have found my mojo this time.

[CDW]

7 hours ago, shipman said:

Here's a Japanese TV program where you get to see nearly every nut, bolt and washer of the engine being stripped in front of a live audience. I don't know of an English dubbed version, but this is a MUST SEE for anyone interested.

 

Thanks so much for posting this. It will be a tremendous reference for building this model. I already see some things I need to correct on my build/painting of it and am glad to see it now rather than later.

[Old Collingwood]

4 hours ago, CDW said:

It all comes back to my recollection now as to why I stopped construction of this little project: it’s all about lacing the wire wheel spokes. In the top of the photo is a tiny paint tin filled with little machined nipples. These must be slid into holes in the rims to capture each spoke. It takes the patience of Job to get this done. I think I have found my mojo this time.

"Spoke Nipples"

 

OC.

[CDW]

3 minutes ago, Old Collingwood said:

"Spoke Nipples"

 

OC.

When you were a kid, did you learn to make spoke guns using old bicycle spokes and nipples? You could really shoot them, albeit the projectiles were very small.

[Old Collingwood]

2 minutes ago, CDW said:

When you were a kid, did you learn to make spoke guns using old bicycle spokes and nipples? You could really shoot them, albeit the projectiles were very small.

No mate,   never  really  played with  bb guns  or  air rifles  (my  mum hated them).

 

My  wheel building  came from working  for a cycle manufacturer  and  some work in cycle shops - lacing and building wheel  and  lots  of truing as part of a  service.

 

OC.

[shipman]

More goodies .... useful and interesting info to be gleaned here.

https://www.motorcyclistonline.com/honda-rc174-rc-reborn/

https://www.philaphoto.com/imageLibrary/thumbnails.php?album=1696

 

It's worth noting, the rc166 and rc174 were externally identical.

The George Beale replicas were built with Honda's co-operation, and I think Honda themselves took one to play with. They were faithful in all details and finishes.

Edited April 22, 2023 by shipman
Aditional info.

[CDW]

19 minutes ago, shipman said:

More goodies .... useful and interesting info to be gleaned here.

https://www.motorcyclistonline.com/honda-rc174-rc-reborn/

https://www.philaphoto.com/imageLibrary/thumbnails.php?album=1696

 

It's worth noting, the rc166 and rc174 were externally identical.

The George Beale replicas were built with Honda's co-operation, and I think Honda themselves took one to play with. They were faithful in all details and finishes.

I noticed that in the video, the engine covers and carbs were gun metal colored but in these photos, a shade of gold.

[shipman]

The covers were magnesium and had to be protected from atmospheric moisture.

I think originally a form of gold paint was used. I believe the black is a chemical derived coating.

Here's an article featuring photo's of this engine in Honda's own museum.

I recon they know what they're doing.

https://caferacergarage.eu/honda-rc166-6-cylinder-racing-legend/

 

More....

http://www.deejay51.com/honda_hall_racebikes.htm

 

I do also think it worth pointing out, though Hailwood is always associated with these bikes, Honda's first world champion was Jim Redman who did most of the early 6's development riding.

Redman had a fall and broke his arm; that's how Hailwood got the job.

Irelands Ralph Bryans also rode them regularly, normally, due to his sleight stature he was normally riding 50 and 125's.

Edited April 22, 2023 by shipman
More!

[Ras Ambrioso]

Now you got me excited. I will be following you. I thought that my Bianchi was complicated. Your engine is a beauty. Kudos

[CDW]

4 hours ago, shipman said:

The covers were magnesium and had to be protected from atmospheric moisture.

Ahh yes, that's obvious now that you've pointed it out. In the early 1960's my dad and older brothers bought a Dart Kart racing go kart with twin Westbend engines. Much of the kart including the wheels, exhaust pipes, fuel tank, etc., were made of magnesium that had that familiar metallic gray color displayed on the Honda engine covers and carbs. Thanks again!

[CDW]

3 hours ago, Ras Ambrioso said:

Now you got me excited. I will be following you. I thought that my Bianchi was complicated. Your engine is a beauty. Kudos

Glad to have you here, Ras. I've been enjoying your build very much.

[CDW]

I spent several hours today assembling the spokes and nipples to the rim only to realize I misaligned the spokes to the rim some way, some how. I have no other choice now but to soak the parts I assembled in acetone to help release the ca glue I used to bond it all together. After cleaning up all the parts, need to start all over again. I think I know where I went wrong and will spend more care to be sure I start in the correct hole. It looked correct for the first half of the build but all turned to cow flop the second half.