New Here--Suggestions for a beginner

[MIR]

New here, looking to build my first ship model. I do have considerable model building experience with plastic kits, mostly armor and the like but never have attempted a ship of any sort. I like ships from the 17 and 18 centuries.  Either wood or plastic........... and yes, the rigging scares the heck out of me which is probably why I have never attempted one for 40 something years in model building

[ccoyle]

A great way to look for potential first builds is to search build log titles using the keywords "finished first build." Those parameters returned 95 results, which you can peruse here. Enjoy!

[Keith Black]

 MIR, welcome to MSW. 

[druxey]

Welcome! And yes, rigging is scary if you've never done it before. However, if you take it slowly and methodically, line by line, it becomes less scary. Like any complex job, break it down into small steps. Also, there's lots of helpful folk available here to answer any really vexing questions you may have.

[GrandpaPhil]

Welcome!

[barkeater]

Welcome. As Chris said, a great way to start would be to search" first finished builds". Also if you l look there are threads under ship model kits which would be helpful and there are discussions on which company puts out the best products including instructions.

[Cathead]

Welcome! As someone who transitioned into wooden ship building from plastic kits (primarily aircraft and model railroading), I'll warn that the learning curve is pretty steep. Wooden ship  building is a very different skill set from even the most complicated plastic kit. It's quite doable, just be aware that it's more of a transition than it seems. On the other hand, a plastic ship kit will use many of your existing skills, just with a lot of fiddly detail like rigging. You might considering starting with something simpler than a full-on ship of the line or galleon, to gain some perspective before you tackle something you're not ready for. A smaller, simpler project won't delay your dreams long but will help prepare you to achieve them!

[mtaylor]

Welcome to MSW.  You might have a look here...  https://modelshipworld.com/topic/18657-new-to-ship-modelling-but-what-do-you-build-first/   Wood is a  process and following the suggestions to start "small" and work your way to larger projects with more masts is a good one.

 

[Nirvana]

Mir, first of all, a warm welcome to MSW!

If you haven't done any sort of rigging this including rigging plastic kits, which several of them has a very complex rigging, I would suggest to start with a kit without any rigging. Many times just the planking (creating the hull) can be overwhelming.

There are a lot of kits that will take you aside from the rigging.

Again, a warm welcome!

[Jaager]

20 hours ago, MIR said:

I do have considerable model building experience with plastic kits, mostly armor and the like

You should probably read the Caution post and the new modeler post.  I will repeat a recent theme.  Except for painting prior experience with plastic kits is more likely to give you an unrealistic expectation about just how much help to expect from wooden ship model kits.   A plastic  kit is in general a world unto itself.  The instructions are usually complete for building the kit.   A wooden ship is part of a much larger world.  There are common skills needed to complete any one of them.  Wooden kit instructions tend to not include those commonly used skills.  You are generally expected to know them before you begin.  If you have no prior experience with fine woodworking, you are well advised to start simple and develop them many skills needed as you go.  The beginner subjects are not sexy, famous or flashy, but they will develop a foundation of needed skills and if you do boats instead of ships, gain particular skills needed for larger vessels.  Pretty much all ships have boats.  the boat part of ship kits are generally weak and small.  A prior grounding in boat construction will help with figuring out how to model a boat at a much smaller scale.   If you had a ship model that matched the scale of a boat kit, it would be the size of you living room couch or larger.   Anyway, the point is that wooden kit instructions are different in nature from instructions for plastic kits.

[knightyo]

I was intimidated by the hobby for years due to people indicating how hard it was.  I finally realized that the hobby is as easy or difficult as you wish to make it.  Since you are already used to working with your hands in the plastic medium, I'll bet you could tackle the USS Syren by Chuck Passaro (sold by Model Shipways).  His instructions are fantastic and far superior to the instruction provided in most kits.   I've also noticed that he pops into people's build logs on this site to offer advice/encouragement.  You can't go wrong with a well-designed kit and the advice you receive in build logs; it also greatly helps if you leave comments in others' build logs who are building the same kit; they will be more likely to view your own build log and forewarn you of upcoming sections they may have found challenging and offer tips/tricks.  

 

In addition to the USS Syren, it sounds like Chris at Vanguard Models also provides high-quality instruction materials.  I haven't built any of his kits, but can tell by the posts I've seen on the forum that he also provides exceptional instruction.  I really don't think you can go wrong with any of Chuck or Chris' kits.  They both also have links to their sites in the right-hand margin on the home page.

 

Alan   

[Bob Cleek]

Further comment on the difference between plastic model kits and wooden ship model kits:

 

Plastic kits are designed to be assembled. Wooden kits are designed to be built. Give some thought to this difference between the two. The plastic kit manufacturer begins with the assumption that their customers know little, if anything, about the prototype subject of their model, be it a car, a plane, a tank, or a ship. If the customer actually knows a little, or a lot, about the prototype, so much the better, but it doesn't take much to "insert peg A into hole A" to yield a satisfactory result. A beginning plastic kit modeler will find success if they pay attention to cleaning off the flash and gluing carefully. Beyond that, plastic modeling is all about finishing and this is where the skills of artistic painting and weathering really separate the beginners from the masters in the plastic modeling game. While not intending to denigrate the skills involved in plastic modeling in the least, they are a fairly limited skill set. 

 

Plastic model kits evolved to provide a way to create miniatures of complex metal objects: cars, planes, tanks, and ships, primarily. Building such a subject in miniature from scratch using metal demands a very high level of skill and craftsmanship that few possess. The creations of those who do so are impressive and, correspondingly, those with such skills have no need for kits to do so.

 

Wooden ship model kits have an entirely different evolutionary history. Wooden ship models were built from scratch from the very beginning and kits, such as they are, only came centuries later. Wooden ship model kits have always been based upon a somewhat false premise: That by providing the raw materials, a set of plans, and perhaps some limited "instructions," anybody could do it. This premise overlooks the fact that building a wooden ship model requires a broad range of skills that cannot be packaged in a box. For openers, the builder's ability to work with wood and metal is a given and it is extremely difficult to write instructions which enable a novice without any fluency in nautical nomenclature to assemble parts the names of which are to the beginning builder a completely foreign language! Then, of course, there is the need to understand how the modeled vessel's rig actually works in real life if a realistic impression of it in miniature is to be achieved. Wooden ship models were, until relatively recent times, almost solely the province of experienced mariners with hands-on familiarity with the prototypes they were modeling. "If it looks right, it is right," was a reliable rule of thumb when the modeler's "vision" was based upon intimate experience with the subject. A seaman who'd spent any time aloft in the age of sail had no difficulty recognizing that a block was out of scale. No so the guy who grew up in Utah who, smitten with "the romance of the sea," drops a few hundred bucks for that big pirated Chinese Victory kit he saw online. (And trust me, the "number of parts" a kit contains is no measure of its quality or value!)

 

Even today, very few ship model kits contain adequate instructions for a novice. (Many, if not most,  kit instructions cause even experienced ship modelers to their personal research libraries, compiled for just such purposes, in order to confirm details of historical accuracy and scale.) So, what little I can add to the sage advice above, assuming you are not an experienced mariner, wooden boat and ship builder, rigger, painter, blacksmith, and sailmaker, is 1) Start simple and 2) read the instructions before you buy the kit!  The second recommendation is more important than the first. As far as I know, only Syren Ship Models and Model Shipways offer online access to their kit instructions. The best of these are those written by Chuck Passaro (of this forum) for Syren and Model Shipways. If you read these instructions from cover to cover and at the end can say, "I think I can do that." you're good to go. If not, the discouraging effort probably saved you a few hundred dollars and a lot of frustration and failure. But, if you start small,  and rely on resources like this forum and the wide spectrum of literature on ship modeling, you will develop the skills and experience as you go along and, given that, yes... anybody can do it.

 

Read the "monograph chapters" of Chuck Passaro's Medway Longboat kit. If you're serious, you won't go far wrong with this one: Medway Longboat (1742) (syrenshipmodelcompany.com)

Edited October 30, 2021 by Bob Cleek

[kurtvd19]

I have to disagree with Bob regarding the Medway Longboat.  Chuck doesn't recommend this as a starter kit.  It's pretty darn small and finicky for a beginner.  We did this as a group project at the local club and few were completed though those that were are excellent models but they were built by some of the better modelers in our group.

 

Bob's entirely correct in start small and simple.

 

Kurt

[ubjs]

Master Korabel kits I think is very good and maybe the woodenkits who is most like plastic kits. They have a Cannon Jolle from 1801, not much rigging.

I think that the first wooden kits you build will not be fantastic but its fun building wooden kits.

Just buy a kit and start building!

[Keith Black]

 Another approach for a beginner with no ship building experience is restoring a model, not a plastic and not a decorative model. If you can't tell the difference between a decorative model and a kit or scratch built model, please look through MSW build logs till you can tell the difference.  Restoring a model takes money (probably as much as buying a good kit) and time both in the doing and research. Spending time and money on a decorative model should be avoided as they have little to no value other than possibly historical.

. 

 This past year the prices for damaged models on eBay, Craigslist, and Marketplace have risen to crazy levels. At one time one could buy a good POB model with damaged mast, bowsprit, and rigging for $80.00 to $100.00. That same model today is selling for three times that amount. So is it worth it? IMHO, I don't think so, not at $300.00 but for $80.00 to $100.00, maybe for the right person. 

 

 

Edited October 31, 2021 by Keith Black

[Thukydides]

Welcome to MSW. I won't belabour the points that others have said, but as from one first time builder to another who came into this with only plastic model experience, I want to really emphasize that starting small is important.

 

The only thing that really helped me from my modeling/miniature painting was knowing how to take my time and read lots before I did anything. You will make mistakes, but the nice thing about wood is that most mistakes can be corrected. Just take your time and read lots of build logs to get an idea of what mistakes others have made.

 

As for model recommdations, I am really enjoying vanguard models alert as a first build. The instructions are fantastic and there are lots of good build logs on it here on MSW which you can lean on.

Edited October 31, 2021 by Thukydides

[EricWilliamMarshall]

@Bob Cleek Shipways now has a series of models aimed at the beginner (not dissimilar to the old Midwest models of yore). The instructions are also posted for the curious. https://modelexpo-online.com/Model-Shipways-Shipwright-Series_c_815.html   (I wish modelshipworld had a wiki or faq to capture some of the great wisdom of answers like yours in one spot!)

 

To @MIR, I second Bob thoughts and a number of others here. If you have time read through a new user build logs and see how they progress and where they stumble. I’m just now in my third year of the hobby, take a look at my logs and you will see my frustrations and lack of knowledge, confidence and skills. But you will also see each project being more complex and closer to “real stuff” the amazes the eye here. I started with a plastic sailing ship, a wood boat with a very simple rig, a simple ship with a bit more rigging and a boat with a planked hull. Each a step up the ladder. Another fellow who started about the same time is @VTHokiEE who started simple and sprinted to the fully complex! Read his build logs.
 

Also, as suggested before, read kit instructions if you can find them! Some will horrify and other will educate you!
 

Most of the skills needed can be picked up quickly without too much fussing. (Mastering those skills is another story!)  But if tasks overwhelm, frustration sets in and you stop. End of skill development.
 

Personally I found having a kit a) with excellent instructions (they need to “wordy”, describing everything!) and b) is quick to build - is the way to go. The link I shared at the beginning of this post has models that I think fit the bill. Pick one of those models or something like that and build it! And if you get stuck, ask questions!

 

The whole point of the suggestions here is many folks bite off more than they can chew the first time, so start by nibbling.

[Moonbug]

    Here's a bit of my experience when I made the shift from plastic modeling kits to wood.  I had build the revel Constitution and a couple of other three mast ships in plastic, so when I made the shift to wood I went with something that looked "cool" - the San Juan Nepomuceno.  Ooof.  Steep learning curve to be sure, and of course made a lot of mistakes.  My advice is to pick up something relatively inexpensive, so that when you DO make mistakes (which is inevitable) it's not a huge deal. For me, I spent a fair amount so not 'getting it right' made me feel a little guilty.

     Since then, I've also built the Swift twice - which I see as a great little ship that lends itself to practice when it comes to planking but also with enough rigging and deck fixtures to get the hang of it.

 

Just my two cents.

[mtdoramike]

On 10/27/2021 at 6:52 AM, MIR said:

New here, looking to build my first ship model. I do have considerable model building experience with plastic kits, mostly armor and the like but never have attempted a ship of any sort. I like ships from the 17 and 18 centuries.  Either wood or plastic........... and yes, the rigging scares the heck out of me which is probably why I have never attempted one for 40 something years in model building

Run don't walk to the nearest exit and look for another hobby........, just kidding, ship modeling can be fun and rewarding. Rigging is my favorite part of ship modeling, it's what brings the model to life and makes people Ooooo and awwww over it. There are books on thre fundementals of boat rigging and once you realize they are all basically rigged the same, it becomes fun although a bit mind numbing at times.