Gregory

It could be accomplished with a straight plank and bending, but would be more challenging..

What you see is the result of spiling...  laid out flat it would look more like this example..

Found in this article, mentioned earlier..  SIMPLE HULL PLANKING TECHNIQUES FOR BEGINNERS

You might achieve the same result with some bending techniques involving soaking, clamping and heating..

Short of the bow, I belive you are correct that the curve would be toward the stern.  My example is not the best..

Chuck's Medway Longboat is a very good example of how it should look.

I don't know if this will need further explanation, however when I lay out the garboard ( and other planks as well ) I place a piece of masking tape along the keel, from the stern to the bow.  For most of the run, the edge will follow the keel.  Where it meets the curve of the bow, I mark it with a pen, then use this as a guide for cutting the plank.

Of course, the plank can be tapered and meet the keel further back,.  The final shape is up to the builder and the desired result.

Going through may stash and uncovered a complete set of OEM sails for the Artesania Latina 1:48 Bounty.

These are also for the " exposed " kits, and will possibly work for any 1:48 similarly rigged ship.

I am willing to donate these to anyone who will pay postage and assure me they will be used on a model.

I look forward to seeing them on a completed ship..

P.S.  Trivia regarding the old MSW site:  Does anyone remember the " Moldy " Bounties?

Make note!  The spru has several sizes, and there are only ten of the smallest size...

This showed up in another discussion..

Eyebolt No Collar

Might be what you need for making smaller hooks.

On 3/9/2019 at 11:08 PM, Dr PR said:

Gregory,

 

That's an interesting idea. Do you first close it down to the desired diameter - by chucking the roper size drill bit?

 

The jaws do not have cutting edges, but I can see how they might "worry" wood into the desired cylindrical shape.

 

I just eyeball the opening and go from there.  The drill bit idea sounds good for getting a little more precision.

I burred up the edges of the chuck teeth a little bit with a cut off wheel.  It doesn't take much to turn it into a rough cutting tool.

I used to do this with various size colletts  before I discovered the chuck.

Just curious..  Could you humor us with some context?

In the image below, is the smallest eyebolt I have in my collection at about 1mm ID..

The red dot is about .25mm ..

It is barely visible when printed and smaller than most of the thread I own.

P.S.

I certainly admire the effort that requires anything at this scale..   It is way off of my radar..

Thanks for sharing..   I was really impressed by  by the precision of your parts, and was waiting for you to tell me you have a laser cutter..

Now I'm even more impressed!

P.S.

Regarding rounding off small square stock.  You have made a very nice tool, however, I have found that a Dremel keyless chuck does a pretty good job, and gives you a fairly wide range on a small scale.. It's also good for further reducing round stock.

Hey Phil,

Nice build you have going here.

Just curious how you fabricate your wood parts, such as your gun carriages?

3 hours ago, amateur said:

Not to question the (obviously correct) observations above, I want to say something in response.

We tend to read Peterson as an historical guide to rigging, in line with others mentioned above: Lees, Biddlecom, Anderson Underhill and a large number of contempory literature on rigging or (near) academic studies into this field.

 

Peterson himself does state other intentions of his book: 

"As a professional illustrator and an amatuer modelmaker I have, along with many others, often found it so difficult to find detailed information about ships [..]. This is particularly true when it comes to the rigging of ships, particularly the rigs of smaller craft."

"My first book was intended to help modellers to understand  a three masted ship rig" [..]

"This [second] book is not intended to be an academic contribution to the field of maritime historical research; as a visual study based solely on three models it is rather intended as an accessible guide for the enthousiast and model shipwright" [..] "I hope that the illustrations will be an inspiration to other modelmakers"

 

All quotes [with minor left outs] from the introduction of his second book on fore-and-aft craft. Peterson himself clearly states the limited historical reliability of his drawings, and also states that an historical study was not his intention. Complaining that his work does not match the historical standards sounds to me as as someone eating dinner at my table  complaining that it is not French haute cuisine

 

Jan

 

 

 

 

I've pointed out more than once that Petterson makes no claims about technical accuracy, and that he is documenting specific models.

The objections here, come from discussions where someone asks for rigging references and Petterson gets thrown in with  with Lees, and etc..

The distinction is important.

I love Petterson's books.  Particularly the first one.  I go to them all the time.  They are very good for showing how 99% of the lines run..  Particularly on the three mast ship..

2 hours ago, bruce d said:

 

I don't want to put you on the spot (well, maybe a little...) but the first subject in the Petersson book is the only one that affects me: it is "The British Naval Cutter", based on a model in the Science Museum. Is this one of the 'pure nonsense' items? Will I regret using his instructions?

 

Thanks, just trying to get it right and glad I found this pool of knowledge.

 

Bruce

I don't want to spend too much time bashing the book, but hope to address questions that have been asked..

Frankie may want to add more, but here is my $ .02 on the cutter.  ( ...which is a favorite subject of mine for modeling, because of it's simplicity.)

Being a relatively simple rig, it is hard to mess up, but one should be careful with kit plans, because they tend to oversimplify, which can be seen when you compare them to more detailed resources.  Petersson apparently documented what he found on one model without comparing to other sources.

Here are two items I question from the book, and maybe someone else can correct me if I am wrong.

I don't understand the purpose of the tackle circled in red.  It appears redundant if not totally unnecessary .  It could conceivably be used to tension the back stay while setting up the other tackle that is seen, but I can't find this set-up anywhere else.  It just jumped out at me when I was doing research for a couple of kits I am looking at.  I don't see it in the contemporary model found here: 

There are several other cutter models in the Gallery, and I don't see that tackle on any of them.

....Or in the plans for Chuck's Cheerful, that can be found here: Chapter 14..  Chuck is not the final word, but I know he researched his Cheerful very thoroughly, and I would feel comfortable rigging any similar cutter with his plans. 

Here's No. 2:

What's up with those fiddle blocks? There are not any lines going through the lower sheave.  Regardless, I don't think you will find such blocks as part of a yard lift tackle on any ship.

Some may say these are no big deal, but it certainly disqualifies this book as a go-to, much less a final source for accurate information on a similar boat.

As I mentioned, these are two problems that jumped out at me as I compared it to other sources.

I don't want to spend a lot of my time, analyzing this book for other errors, but I must assume they are there, and will double check anything I find myself looking at for future reference.

Of course, someone more knowledgeable than me, might look at what I have posted and inform me about how wrong I am.

I will certainly welcome any criticism.

Gregory

Frankie might have more to say, but the problems arise from the subjects Petersn chose for his reference.  He claims he studied contemporary models and draws them as he found them. Some of his details are just wrong regarding how a particular line leads from here to there, on a real ship.  This may ( probably ) be because the model in question was /is in error.  There is no reason to doubt that Petersn accurately documented what he observed.

I was oblivious to this until Frankie pointed it out, but I would have to dig to find an example, which I might do later.

Personally, I like both of his books, but now know not to accept them as being accurate without a lot of double checking.

I don't care too much about the stands, but I would like to hear more about the " vices "..

I really like the weathered look of your deck..

Regards, tapering.  

There are those who will decry the use of something like an Xacto blade or scalpel, because of a tendency for the blade to follow the grain, making precise cutting, where you want it, difficult.  However I have found with patience and careful prep, it can be very effective, particularly for straight lines.  Cutting curves become a whole new problem.

In the short video below, I show how I marked a strip, and tapered it a few inches, from 10mm to about 8 with an Xacto.  You have to make sure the straight edge and strip are held very firmly, and make the cut with several shallow cuts.

Here is an excellent log of this ship, showing some planking technique.

HMS Bounty by Steve

17 hours ago, SardonicMeow said:

Interesting.  I didn't know that not all plywood is created equal.  Where would I get quality plywood and how would I know it's good?

 

I should have mentioned in my original post that all the laser cut pieces will be planked over and/or painted over, so the appearance of the wood doesn't matter to me.

 

 I have used this 1/8 plywood from Amazon.

3 mm 1/8" x 8" x 8" Premium Baltic Birch Plywood

P.S.

You can shop around on Amazon for various dimensions..

This is more versatile at 12" x 24" ..

3 mm 1/8"x 12"x 24"Premium Baltic Birch Plywood

Don't shy away from good quality plywood for your frame parts.

A good example is Chuck's Cheerful project.  Click through the log to see the plywood framing..

Of course, you don't want plywood showing on the outside of your model, so the " finish " parts should be  woods like boxwood, pear and the Alaskan yellow cedar that is showing up lately.   There are many other choices, but those are a few.

How precise your cutting is, will depend on the machine itself, and you will have to experiment.

The best examples I know of is our own, Chuck Passaro's  Syren Ship Model Company

He turns out parts in boxwood that are 1/32" thick, and having dimensions in that range, if not smaller, also.

Stern Lantern Kit

For what it's worth, I have a low power laser engraver that needs several passes to cut through anything thicker than card stock.  However, it is great for making precise patterns that I can then cut out with my jig saw, and follow up with detailed finishing.

Very nice..

What type of wood?

I will 2nd mtaylor and GrandpaPhil's suggestion of Historic Ship Models by Wolfram zu Mondfeld

Another good thing to keep in mind, If you happen to purchase a kit from ModelExpo  ( which also has an eBay store ), they will replace lost or broken parts, no questions asked...

I like the wood finish on the box art, however, the glue/water mix would certainly seal the wood to some degree and make

any further natural finishing difficult.

Do the instructions call for painting?

Thanks for taking the time... 

With all the kits we have going here, and assuming the plans are fairly accurate, comparing the steeve angles might be an interesting exercise.

37 minutes ago, BANYAN said:

Underhill also discusses the angles of the bowsprit in his book "Masting and Rigging the Clipper Ship and Ocean Transport"; may be worth a read.

 

cheers

 

Pat

Perhaps you could share a brief synopsis of his conclusions before we all rush out and buy the book? 

Boxwood is always a good choice in any font...

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