Grecian by DB789 - FINISHED - Vanguard Models - 1:64 - American Privateer Schooner

[DB789]

I should be finishing off the last tweaks on Alert, but I couldn’t resist starting Vanguard’s Grecian at the same time. Other than JamesH who builds the prototype and provides an excellent build log too, I think I’m the first to do a build log on this kit, so I’ll try and provide a bit more detail than I did on Alert. 

The kit came very promptly via UPS and extremely well packaged in a robust, well designed box. 

Inside the box there’s a large range of laser cut wooden and MDF sheets. Except for the decks the wood is all pear. The laser cut on these sheets is incredibly clean and precise. Not all the sheets are shown below. 
There’s also a box of fixtures including high quality resin cannon. There’s copper tape for the hull, a resin cutter, 3 sheets of photo etch, box of thread for the rigging, pear and lime planking strips, dowels, Vanguard’s standard but brilliant colour building manual full of step by step photos and instructions, eleven large plan sheets, and a clear acetate cradle for the completed build.
 

I went for all the extras too, so I bought the Grecian paint set, American flag, pear block set and PE copper plate set (not sure yet if I’ll use this or the tape - whichever is easier I suspect).
 

It is all absolutely excellent quality. 
This will be my seventh Vanguard build and the first time that one of the parts came broken - a dowel. I messaged Chris and within a day or two he’d sent me a replacement. Amazing customer service. 
 

 

There’s one other tiny error in the instructions that in the inventory there’s a sheet of 0.1mm PE listed that wasn’t included. I asked Chris and  he tells me that this was for copper sheet to face the rudder, but he couldn’t obtain the copper so it’s not needed for the build.

I was curious how big the completed Grecian would be. So here is Nisha and Alert against a plan of her deck. She makes Nisha look tiny. 

And is bigger than Alert, but by less than I had expected. 

Cant wait to get building her! 

 

 

 

 

[Knocklouder]

Best of luck on your journey!!  

[DB789]

This first stage of construction is where Vanguard’s better design just comes into its own. The process for building the ‘skeleton’ of her hull is just so clever and well thought out, avoiding the alignment and warping risks I read about so often with kits from other manufacturers. 
 

Firstly, the bulkheads are slotted onto the false keel, but not glued. Then another piece is slotted on each side of the keel, locking down the bulkheads. As soon as this is done, the structure starts to strengthen. 
MDF tabs are then pushed through holes in all three keel pieces ensuring that these, and the bulkheads are absolutely aligned. 
 

Then the sub-deck is fitted and also held in place with tabs. Further strengthening the structure.  
Then the aft bulkhead is built up, ready to be faired. 
I need to shape this next, but the glue needs to set overnight.
 

Once that is done I’ll add it to the hull with additional longitudinal bracing parts. Once those are in the structure will be rock solid, completely aligned and ready for glue. 

 

 

[AJohnson]

Dan, wow, first out of the traps again! - Whoosh! 😁

[James H]

Just a quick note about the orientation of your photos. 

 

Check this out so you can post pictures so they are the right way around:

 

 

[DB789]

On 6/21/2023 at 9:56 PM, AJohnson said:

Dan, wow, first out of the traps again! - Whoosh! 😁

Thanks Andrew, wish I wasn’t and had more build photos to refer to! The instructions and prototype build log are excellent, but having more photos from different angles also helps. 

[DB789]

On 6/22/2023 at 4:37 PM, James H said:

Just a quick note about the orientation of your photos. 

 

Check this out so you can post pictures so they are the right way around:

 

 

Thanks Jim, I’ll make more effort to get the photos in the correct orientation.

 

I do most, if not all, of my posting on MSW using a work provided iPhone or laptop which I don’t have admin rights to install a programme on - such as the excellent photo resizer you sent me a link to. Wish I could use it. 

[AJohnson]

2 hours ago, DB789 said:

Thanks Andrew, wish I wasn’t and had more build photos to refer to! The instructions and prototype build log are excellent, but having more photos from different angles also helps. 

With the other Vanguard models you’ve done I’m sure you will be fine! 😁

[DB789]

This is the shaped stern bulkhead. 

Then I make a mistake which I only realise later, but seems inconsequential. I should have added additional longitudinal beams (parts 33) to brace the aft bulkheads but somehow I missed them despite them being clearly there in the instructions. 
 

Instead I went straight for the sub-deck which comes in two pieces. 

The bow is then built up. The laser cutting of the MDF is wafer thin, I didn’t realise you would be able to cut MDF so thin. Yes I broke one of the slots but that’s me being clumsy. 

Beams are added across the hull, further adding to the strength of the already very strong structure. 

[Cathead]

Cool, I had fun following the prototype log and it'll be neat to see what an independent builder does.

[DB789]

Next, the deck is added. As for the fishing boats it slots nicely into grooves at the base of the bulkhead ears. There’s a separate section of deck at the stern which slots in too. Very neat. 
This is the point where diluted PVA needs to be added to all the joints in the structure. There’s still a small amount of bowing in the middle of the deck so it needs to be held down whilst the needs to be glue sets. I did this using small clamps through the hatch openings. 
 

The structures on the stern are then built up out MDF pieces and further pieces of MDF added under the stern deck to strengthen it and provide a base for the lower counter. 


At the bow a piece with a hole for the bowsprit is added as are both sets of parts 23 and 24 on the cheeks either side of the bow. 

Once the glue is set, it’s time to fair the hull. This is pretty straightforward, her lines are sleek and there are no difficult curves. I have tested planks lying across the bulkheads multiple times and looking good. 
What I don’t do initially is fair the top of the bow where the piece of wood with the bowsprit hole is. 

Jumping onto step 69 that myxyzptlyk2003 refers to in James H’s blog, there isn’t a photo of this in the instructions - but trial and error (photo below) shows that this needs fairing too and can be seen in the Step 115 as myxyz says. 

Once faired, I test fit the middle bulwark pattern again and then soak it in hot water so I can bend it around the curve of the hull astern. The bulwark is clamped and pinned and to dry, waiting to be glued once it’s dried out. 

Jim warns us in the instructions that the gun port arches are not strong. I can confirm that they are not. I broke two of them off the middle bulwark on the starboard side whilst attaching the port bulwark. Once the wood had dried out I  glued them back on cleanly using PVA. 
 

Furthermore I somehow broke an arch on one of the outer patterns. I didn’t realise this had happened and the part is long gone. I tried to make a replacement archway, but realised my skills aren’t sufficient to make it look good on an outer piece! So I have resorted to ordering a replacement from Chris. 

Edited June 26, 2023 by DB789

[DB789]

16 minutes ago, Cathead said:

Cool, I had fun following the prototype log and it'll be neat to see what an independent builder does.

You’re very welcome! I’ll be sticking close to what Jim built in the prototype, but without anything like the same level of experience or skill. 

[James H]

18 minutes ago, DB789 said:

There’s still a small amount of bowing in the middle of the deck so it needs to be held down whilst the needs to be glue sets.

There really should be zero bowing. Before you glued, I'd have suggested every bulkhead was fully seated and the deck located exactly into each ear.

 

The deck is designed to lie absolutely flat onto the frames, with zero elevation anywhere.

[chris watton]

You really need to sand more of that bowsprit area, the bulwarks should be a nice line, with no kinking. Also, there is no need to soak the bulwark patterns, the curves are very slight.

 

Here's a photo from manual showing how that bowsprit area is when sanded.

[DB789]

1 hour ago, James H said:

There really should be zero bowing. Before you glued, I'd have suggested every bulkhead was fully seated and the deck located exactly into each ear.

 

The deck is designed to lie absolutely flat onto the frames, with zero elevation anywhere.

 

It’s bound to be something I’ve done wrong. Not sure what though, I drew lines marking the bottom of the slot of every bulkhead to ensure they were seated properly. I also checked that the deck was located exactly into each ear. The bowing was only very slight, but I needed to clamp it to ensure that there was contact for the PVA. 

[DB789]

1 hour ago, chris watton said:

You really need to sand more of that bowsprit area, the bulwarks should be a nice line, with no kinking. Also, there is no need to soak the bulwark patterns, the curves are very slight.

 

Here's a photo from manual showing how that bowsprit area is when sanded.

Thanks Chris, 

 

The photo was my test fitting - held on by hand and a single pin. I quickly realised that I needed to sand the bowsprit area and did so before any soaking or glueing. It wasn’t my final position for it. Sorry I should have been clearer above. 
 

In step 73 the instructions suggest soaking the bulwark as an option instead of scoring the bottom of the bulwark to bend around the  bulkheads. I felt more comfortable soaking than scoring and cracking the wood. The rest of the curves are indeed very slight. 

[Craigie65]

Hey Dan,

Found your log and will pull up the proverbial chair.

Looking good so far, she has really sharp lines.

On the coppering, my vote would be for the pre cut plates.  Don’t fancy having to cut all those individually from a roll of tape……

 

[DB789]

On 6/27/2023 at 8:18 PM, Craigie65 said:

Hey Dan,

Found your log and will pull up the proverbial chair.

Looking good so far, she has really sharp lines.

On the coppering, my vote would be for the pre cut plates.  Don’t fancy having to cut all those individually from a roll of tape……

 

Hi Craig, you’re welcome! 

[DB789]

I’ve fitted the outer bulwark, then the engraved deck which goes on very well with a little sanding at the edges and then the inner bulwarks.
 

Soaking, clamping and pinning the middle bulwark has very slightly distorted the middle bulwark meaning that the gunports on the middle bulwark no longer match up exactly with the gunports on the inner and outer bulwarks. The difference isn’t much, but it’s not as exact as it would be if I hadn’t soaked it. I’ve gently sanded the sides and bottom of the gunports and may need a tiny amount of filler to get clean edges for painting. I haven’t sanded the arches yet as I don’t want to weaken them. 


The inner lower counter is fitted and then first planking starts. Grecian’s lines are very gentle to plank with lots of bulkheads to guide the shape and I barely need to edge bend. Possibly the easiest boat to first plank I’ve built so far - and maybe I’m getting a little better at it. 
 

As the instructions say, lots of tapering is essential at the bow and no tapering with some stealers at the stern. I started doing the planks in halves, but it wasn’t really necessary on this boat. 
 

The structure is so robust I have no fear of warping the keel by planking one side at a time. I’ve just done the port side so far. 

After some initial sanding. 
Apologies for the orientation of some of the photos, I can’t fix them on my iPhone. 
 

The only slight concern I have is where the counter meets the planking. I need to sand some more, but with hindsight maybe should have taken more off the underlying stern bulkhead structure when fairing. 

Edited July 7, 2023 by DB789

[DB789]

Starboard side first planking went on just as easily. 
I had some spare stubs of dowel which  I stuck in the mast holes, almost an Admiralty style model, these are helping provide some protection to the gun port arches when I’m working on the planking on the upside down hull.

 

After sanding and filling there is a really good firm base now in place for the second planking. 
Outer lower counter fitted, glued and clamped. 

Second planking went on well too. Port side complete below. 

The only area I found at all tricky was the more complex curve around the “Y” of the stern. The white filler lines show a little clinkering. Clearly my edge bending skills need further development! 

Grecian will have a black painted and coppered hull so I can be liberal with white filler. 
 

I also applied some Danish oil to the engraved deck to darken it a little. Usually I leave it until later when I’ve smeared glue in places from deck fittings and it leaves the oil blotchy, applying it early should reduce blotches.

I need to start thinking about armament soon. I’ll be fitting her out as an American ship with Vanguard’s period US ensign and green inner bulwarks, but the US privateer armament of 2 x 6-pounders and 2 x 4 pounders is a bit meagre for a ship pierced for 16-18 guns. Even the RN complement of 2 x 6 pounders and 8 x carronades will leave the model looking bare. I suspect I’ll do something more similar to the plans with 12 carronades and 4 cannon. 

 

Edited July 17, 2023 by DB789

[chris watton]

I do not think I have planked a hull yet that hasn't had that clinker effect somewhere....

[DB789]

On 7/17/2023 at 5:58 PM, chris watton said:

I do not think I have planked a hull yet that hasn't had that clinker effect somewhere....

Thanks Chris, that’s reassuring to hear! 
 

Second planking now complete. A bit more filler on the starboard side. 

I have clearly positioned the outer counter slightly wrongly, the ablutions hole is much closer to the edge than in the instructions, especially when I sanded the stern ready for the stern board. The ablutions hole is lined up with the hole on the inner lower counter so I suspect that my mistake was there. It won’t be noticeable when Grecian is complete. 

The stern board is 2mm thick and I soaked it and held it in place with rubber bands whilst it dried to give it the gentle curve required around the stern. After drying for 24 hours it’s now glued in place. 

I’ve also been filling and tidying up the insides of the gunports where the middle bulwark has changed shape slightly due to soaking. 
 

I’m painting Grecian using Vanguard’s Grecian painting set which uses AK paints. I’ll be brush painting the hull rather than using an airbrush. Should I thin the paints and if so with what (water?) and in what proportions?  The paint has gone on extremely well unthinned on small parts such as the cannons, but I tried painting a patch of hull and it was quite treacly to apply. 

 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I usually use a spray can for the hull and then the rest of the painting with Humbrol enamel paints so this is a bit different for me. Thanks! 

[AJohnson]

A very sleek looking ship Dan, well done. 👏

[DB789]

On 7/22/2023 at 7:53 PM, AJohnson said:

A very sleek looking ship Dan, well done. 👏

Thanks Andrew! 

[DB789]

I decided to err from the sequence of the instructions which suggested cladding the two deck house astern before painting the hull. To me this risked getting paint on wood that would not be painted later, so I have left the cladding off for now.
 

I also decided to paint the bottom half of the hull first as that’s where the sanding and filling is required. 
 

I diluted the black AK acrylic paint with ~50% water and it seemed to go on much better but needed lots of coats to cover any white filler. 
 

Then the inner green bulwarks AK green with a spot or two of black in it. The deck was carefully masked off first. Then finally the white strip on each side of the gunwales. I diluted the white down too as it was too gloopy and sticky undiluted but very weak in colour diluted. 
 

I painted throughout with a brush which creates two problems 1) the paint bleeds much more under the Tamiya masking tape, making clean lines hard to achieve and 2) shed brush hairs in the painted surface. Fixing any bleed with the white was very difficult as it needed about five coats of it to cover any black or green paint. 
Deck furniture is not glued on, nor cannons. 
 

I’d like to add a breach rope to the cannons (not full cannon rigging) can anyone advise me what thickness of rope to use? Likewise for the carronades.  Many thanks 

[Craigie65]

Wow!

Looks first class to me, you are doing a grand job.  You cannot see any bleed in the pictures, even when blown up.  We are often our own harshest critics.  The colour scheme is really striking. I do like that shade of green.

 

Looking forward to her being fitted out.

[DB789]

Thanks Craig, I always find the photos very forgiving!

Next was cladding the rear deckhouses. 

The pear cladding needed to be trimmed to fit which was fairly straightforward. I also sanded the underlying MDF to ensure a good fit which seemed a good idea at the time but now there’s a gap each side of the tiller housing and will be in the decking above which I need to fill. 

Next I marked out the waterline which was easy on this vessel using a waterline marking tool from Vanguard. 

I bought the PE copper sheets from Vanguard but decided to use the copper tape that came with the kit instead. I was weighing up the merits of the self adhesive copper strip vs. the better looking copper plates but decided that the copper plates looked harder to bend to shape and I’d likely get CA glue everywhere. The copper tape goes on easily but it’s difficult not to let it crinkle. 
 

Starboard side first and rudder. 

Then port side. 
The copper is very bright and shiny. I’m guessing that it will weather down with time. Is there a way of accelerating this and should I varnish over the top? 

[James H]

With the prototype, I made sure all the plates were buffed down as much as possible to remove any wrinkle, and then I used some isopropyl alcohol to remove any grease from my fingers. 

 

From there, I used 0000 steel wool to really shine it up before then applying acrylic matt varnish to it. That makes it look nice and uniform without the shine. If you want patina, don't varnish and let the copper tarnish itself, BUT don't go touching it again or you could see fingerprints in that patina, from the acid in your skin.

[DB789]

6 hours ago, James H said:

With the prototype, I made sure all the plates were buffed down as much as possible to remove any wrinkle, and then I used some isopropyl alcohol to remove any grease from my fingers. 

 

From there, I used 0000 steel wool to really shine it up before then applying acrylic matt varnish to it. That makes it look nice and uniform without the shine. If you want patina, don't varnish and let the copper tarnish itself, BUT don't go touching it again or you could see fingerprints in that patina, from the acid in your skin.

Thanks Jim, I really appreciate your advice. I’ll need to order some steel wool. Once I’ve used it I think I’ll not varnish so the copper tarnishes naturally. I’ll hold off on the steel wool until the hull is fitted out as it’s hard to add the fittings without handling the copper hull. 
 

[aliluke]

Hi Dan

This is looking great! Every time I see this ship I like it more.

 

For breeching ropes I use 0.6mm Morope which feels about right to me.

For accelerating the aging of copper I use a radical technique, which you can see in my Fly log, but there are other ways of doing it which might be more pleasant...