Syren by JesseLee - FINISHED - Model Shipways - scale: 1:64

[JesseLee]

Thanks so much for the well wishes & encouragement. This is one of the many reasons I love this group of people here at MSW.

 

As I work on filing & shaping these parts into something useable my mind is thinking of things I could try to do. I've noticed on every body else's Syren builds they say the carronades supplied in the kit are not as thick as they should be. Since I cant buy more I wonder if it is possible to wrap them with thin paper & CA glue to thicken them up Keeping them filed & shaped right as I do this. It would take a lot more time but I think maybe it is possible?????? Anybody ever tried anything like that? Might try making one out of  a wooden dowel just to see how difficult it is. Or... I could just use them as they are knowing they should be thicker barrels.

 

Also thinking ahead. The plans have the ship rigged with no sails. I'm wondering about furled sails. Haven't seen anyone do this on a Syren model. Problem is I don't have enough rigging knowledge to know how to deviate from prepared instructions & alter the rigging if I were to do this but I would like the way it would look with furled sails.

 

Any thoughts or input on these ideas???

 

Jesse

[donrobinson]

Hi Jesse, although I have never tried thickening a cannon I was thinking maybe epoxy glue may work better, letting it partially dry first then apply it. It would dry real hard and stick well would prevent the frayed look you might get from ca and paper.

 As for the sails I'm not much help there either my only attempt was a complete failure

 It is all looking good though, keep it up

 

Take Care

[cog]

Hello JesseLee,

 

I'm not familiar with the plans on the rigging for the Syren, but there is a book: The Mastereing and Rigging of English Ships of War 1625 - 1860 / Lees, which could help you out. I've got my copy second hand and it is quite pristine. Unfortunately I cannot remember the price ... Maybe a library of some sorts could help you out if it is to expensive ... Or if you need specific information, I'm happy to scan some pages so you can see if it will be of any use - send me a PM with your requirements ...

 

Cheers

[Beef Wellington]

Jesse- any pictures of the carronades? Curious how 'out' they are/look..

 

I'm far from the authority on the running rigging but a few books have been helpful to me (especially Lennarth Peterson - Rigging Period Ship Models which has nie simple pictures).  My impression is that the rigging belaying points don't change if you're rigging with sails, its just whether they are bent to a sail or to the end of another line...I'm sure others can expand on my horrible description.

[riverboat]

Hi Jesse.... just been thru your log.....What a great!! build.... enjoyed your cat too!!

 

Frank

[Elijah]

I'm not sure on your questions, but I will look through my favorite book for these kind of issues. (The Lore of Ships)

[GaryKap]

Jesse 

 

Regarding the carronade barrels, my inclination is to leave them as is...or invest in the pricey brass alternatives.  I think that if you try to "fatten them up" by any means it would just look worse.  But I do agree with you - those poorly cast cannon barrels detract from the overall model and do not add to it.  But sometimes you have to play the hand you are dealt.

 

<<Gary>>

[JesseLee]

Here is a picture. The carronade barrels are not anywhere near as thick as the plans show them.

 

 

[GLakie]

I think turning them out of wood is probably the better of choices. At least when compared to building them up that much!  The real trick is getting them all consistent, but it's doable. 

[donrobinson]

Wow what a difference, they aren't even close to being what is shown on the plans. Such a nice kit and they send that with it! My feelings are that trying to build those up would be quite an undertaking. I think making new ones, even from wood if need be, would be a much better option. I'm not sure what you have for tools lathe? dremel? drill press? but using anyone of these could do the job and give you a better result than what you have now.

 Just my 2(CDN)cents worth(approx. 1.5 US)

[_SalD_]

Hi Jesse, I had thought about doing something similar before I took the easy way out and bought replacement cannonades from Bluejacket.  I had thought about dipping the cannons in thinned black paint a number of times to build up their thickness, sort of like dipping candles in wax.  I never tried it so I'm not sure if it would work.  If you need extra cannonades to experiment on let me know I can send you the ones from the kit I didn't use.

 

Not sure about the sails.

[cog]

JesseLee,

 

That's a hughe difference!!! You might want to take George's and Don's advice, although Sal's method is quick and easy ... That's a tough one ...

 

Cheers

[Elijah]

Here's this. I might be able to send more later.

[cog]

Dirk has got a good one there, forgot I've got it too(!) You might as well try the American site from Abe: http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?sts=t&tn=Rigging+Period+Ship+Models

 

Cheers

[GaryKap]

Hi Jesse -

More thoughts after reading comments by recent reviewers.  The carronade barrels from Blue Jacket are $3.49 each times 16 with shipping comes to over $60.  Whether this is a lot or a little depends on the circumstances of individual modelers.  It is about a third of the price I paid for the entire kit.   These are better than the barrels supplied in the kit but are not perfect.  As SalD shows on page 15 of his build log, the part on the back that the elevating screw passes through needs to be added, and the lug on the bottom needs to be re-shaped.  Too bad Chuck Passaro does not offer some nice replacement brass carronade barrels for the SYREN kit at a reasonable price...  Notice that the barrels he shows in the "Instruction Manual" look much nicer than those we got.

 

Some folks suggested turning the barrels from wood.  Nice idea.  I wish I had the skills and the lathe to do it.  If I did, I might be tempted to machine them from brass or aluminum.  

 

So here we are.  I will be interested to see which alternative you select.  Good luck.

 

<<Gary>>

[JesseLee]

Well, after starting to try wrapping with paper & CA, everyone was right. Way too much thickening required & I gave up on that idea. Thought I'd see how difficult turning Carronade barrels out of wood dowels would be. Held in a drill & using mostly files This is how the first one looks. This is somewhat difficult & time consuming for me but still much less time consuming than the paper & CA would be. I tried to use a pattern for shaping the whole barrel at one time cut into the side of a piece of metal but for some reason it wouldn't cut the wood. So I'm cutting each section with the files & modeling blades. Have actually got a second one turned & got them the same but wondering how difficult it will be to keep them consistent since there has to be 16 of them.

 

Jesse

 

 

[CaptainSteve]

Great work, Jesse. The new wooden carronade is a vast improvement.

Could you use the metal pattern shape as a template guide to check how much more shaping was required ??

I realize this doesn't reduce the amount of work you will need to do, but will help to maintain consistency across all of the new cannons.

[GLakie]

Nice job on the carronade Jesse! Steve's got a good idea with using a template as a guide! 

[dgbot]

Jessie are you set up for casting them in resin?  This would be a better alternative than turning each one.

David B

[mtaylor]

Jesse,

 

What David said.. is casting an option?

[Keith Simmons]

Hi Jesse, looks like a good start, plan to keep an eye on this build.....

[gjdale]

Nice job on turning the carronades Jesse.

[cog]

Good result in shaping a caronnade from a dowel, JesseLee. I would as Steve suggested make a pattern to check the overal shape of the caronnade. Then you'll know how much you need to take off, and where, at certain stages during the process.

 

Casting with resin may be an option as suggested, although I do not know the costs. You've got your initial form to make the mold ... Kees de Mol did some resin work on his build too (look here: http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/10339-kw88-pelikaan-by-kees-de-mol-dutch-beamtrawler-1999-scale-175/page-5#entry376627  ) It does have it's merrits ...

 

Cheers

Edited March 26, 2016 by cog

[GaryKap]

Jesse -

 

Wow!!! Nicely done.  You clearly found a better solution to the problem.  Keep us posted on your progress.

 

<<Gary>>

[JesseLee]

Thanks for all the feedback! No, I'm not set up for casting & have never done any before. Pondering my options. Operating on a shoestring budget & my hobbies usually rate last in priorities since I lost control of the budget after becoming sick. If I do have to turn them all I will be making a better metal template to keep everything the same. Oh, & welcome to my build log Keith!

 

Jesse

[Canute]

Jesse, your carronades turned out great. Cap'n Steve's template will help keep those consistent.

[Piet]

Great job on the wooden cannonade JesseLee, perfection.  Give Sawdust Dave a PM and ask him for assistance on mold making and casting.  Hobby lobby and any arts and crafts store have these kits in stock and are rather inexpensive.

On the other hand though, making them from wood is a fun thing to do, hmmm, I'm smiling as I say that    After a few you'll get the hang of it and can turn them out in a hurry.  Satisfaction of a job well done is worth it's weight in gold.  Keep plugging at it my friend, you are now in the scratch build world.

 

Cheers,

[rtropp]

Jessie,

nice carronade.  

I am trying to turn the belaying pins and know how difficult that must be.  

Do you intend to paint and if so, what are you planning to use.?

 

Richard

[JesseLee]

Richard, I have been thinking about that. I'm wondering if they will still look like wood even when painted. If so is there some easy way to make them appear more like metal? Maybe paint them with a metal paint such as silver or brass or copper first? I also have noticed how much better blackened metal looks compared to black painted.. Wondering if there is some paint mixing method of making the black paint look more like blackened metal.

 

Jesse

[cog]

JesseLee,

 

You need to paint them first with a very diluted primer, sand it after drying (you may want to repeat this step), and again with a normal primer and sand it with a very fine sand paper, or nail polisher stick. After that you can paint them in which ever way you want ... maybe a mixture of gunmetal and black ... try it out before you apply it to the carronades

 

Cheers

Edited March 27, 2016 by cog