HMS Kingfisher 1770 by Remco - 1/48 - English 14 Gun Sloop - POF

[Remcohe]

Thank you all for your very generous comments and likes. It's you folks that keep me building, without MSW I probably would have quit years ago to start an other model only to leave it unfinished later. 

 

I moved on to the capstan step. The first version had no rebated parts, I didn't like it and made a second and a third version. The second was scrapped as I chipped a bit of that was very visible the third one is below.

 

 

 

I'm also considering redoing the cross blocks for the main mast step. I was not paying attention an accidentally added bolts that are way to big. Most bolts in the build are 1" but in this case I need 0,75" bolts like the ones on the capstan step. The difference is quite obvious.......

 

 

Remco

Edited January 8, 2016 by Remco

[tlevine]

Your work is the epitome of perfection.  No one would know those bolts are 1/4" too large unless you told them.  But of course you will always know.  As I am less of a perfectionist than you, I would leave it since overall the construction is very sharp and use that time to move forward rather than look backward.  My TFFM is full of sticky-notes for "the next one".

[cog]

Hmmm, Remco, just a year ... it seems like yesterday ... how time flies ... Again some truly magnificent work you keep on delivering... !!!

 

Cheers,

[amateur]

The difference is very obvious, but you could also tell the public that that is how it was done in real life.

But then again, you made keys for the doors on the lowest deck, redid already perfect parts when you thought they were only near-perfect.

So yeah, I could understand that this difference is bothering you quite a lot while you are lying awake at midnight.....

 

But seriously, your model is a delight to look at!

 

Jan

[Mike Y]

Remco, you are also a master of inspiration - for example, that build log was a tipping point for me to start a fully framed model

Please keep up the great build! Somebody need to set the bar for the accuracy and quality

[Piet]

That capstan step is a marvelous piece of work Remco.  I have a question thought.  From a strictly engineering point I would think that each peace of the three would have two 3/4 inch bolts at the ends instead of the one in the center you are showing.  Is this per the drawings?

 

Also from an engineering point of view, a 1/4 inch difference in bolt size is a big deal - in real life.  There is less material at the edges and can easily tear the wood apart.  Knowing you - - - it's already being remade and kudos to you my dear friend.  

So what are a couple of evenings or weekend days - - it's only time and when you have a near perfect model letting something like this, to many hohum discrepancies, go can lead to more "oh, it's okay" attitude.  

 

It's ultimately the builder who has to satisfy him / herself to continue wit a near perfect build.  Go for it Remco, otherwise it'll be tearing at your heart forever.

 

Cheers, 

Edited January 9, 2016 by Piet

[albert]

Hi Remco, wonderful work.

[Remcohe]

I'm going to redo the mast step, I try to avoid "I'll do that better on the next one"  as much as possible. Before you know........

 

Ok but first the port stops for the gunport and sweep ports. A nice challenge to follow the contour of the hull. Well, I just used the hull to mark the contour and the rest was a matter of time and patience, fun to make.

 

 

 

Here you can see something that concerns me, the black strikes getting lighter and lighter over time. And also quit blotched  I used Fieblings to dye pear strips of wood. Unfortunately it already received a few coats of finish (tungoil) so there is not much I can do about it.

 

Remco

 

 

[Jim Lad]

Yet more very fine work, Remco.

 

John

[mobbsie]

Could you not use a spirit based solution on the Black Strikes to try and draw out the Tung oil, I've never tried it but it may work.

 

Beautiful works as always mate.

 

Be Good

 

mobbsie

[michael20]

You are your own worst critic. I think it looks fantastic the way it is Remco.  Looking forward to see more to come.

 

            Happy Modeling.

                Marty G.

[oneslim]

Very nice,  very clean work.

 

Bob W

[captgino]

Splendide!

[ChrisLBren]

Hey Remco

Ive noticed the same thing on my Confederacy's wales - not much you can do about it.  Needless to say I will not use Fiebings on the next build.

[druxey]

I've generally not had problems with Fiebings, except on one lot of wood where the dye uptake was blotchy and I had to paint.

[dvm27]

Nice job on the port and sweep linings. Fun? Maybe the first few, but after that a lot of tedium!

[Piet]

Very nice work on the port and sweeps lining Remco.  Bummer with the Fiebings die.  Could be a wood and die incompatibility thing.  Last resort - - - paint?  Removing tung oil may be a vert tricky operation and also very time consuming.  Fine art restores may be able to give you advice in what to use.

On wood I would think - wetting  with a solvent and suction - wetting and suction ad invenitum.

 

Cheers, 

[Burroak]

Remco your work is outstanding! WOW!

 

 

Greg H.

[druxey]

If one needs to paint, sanding lightly first before any solvent use would be good. Too much solvent may affect the glue in the model.

[EdT]

Remco, your work is beautiful and I am sorry you are having finish problems.  Frankly, I cannot detect anything in the photos, but I know we are often our own worst critics.  One could not do extraordinary work like yours without that.

 

I will preface the following by saying I realize I am swimming upstream in the face of many modelers who use dyes on their models.  So, forgive me.  One problem is that all dyes fade with time.  This is accelerated by UV light that breaks down complex aniline dye molecules.  I suppose it is possible that compounds in wood may also react chemically with the dye.  I don't know about this, but it may account for some of the effects noted.  I have not used Fiebings but I assume it is aniline based.  Virtually all dyes today are.  However,  I have used other good quality aniline dyes on furniture work because they are much clearer that pigmented stains in transparent finishes.  All these pieces have faded over time.  I have searched in vain for non-fading dyes.  Pigments, like carbon black, do not fade since elemental carbon is not a molecule that can be broken down. This is true for most pigment colors.  Any good pigmented ink, for example artist's acrylic inks  or India ink will never fade.  Finely dispersed pigments in these products will penetrate the wood fibers and stain like dye.  Also, they will be locked in the ink binder when dry - acrylic polymer or in the case of India Ink, I believe, shellac.  This introduces another problem with dyes.  They remain soluble after drying, meaning that if water borne they will run when dampened unless a topcoat is applied.  Solvent borne dyes will run if wet with solvent - unless the dyes contain a binder, which I believe is not typical.

 

Ed

 

Addendum:  Since I have not used Fiebings, I checked into it.  From the attached MSDS sheet it is clear that although sold as a dye, it is in fact pigmented with metal oxides, so although apparently not carbon black, it should not be subject to the fading problem I describe above.   

Fiebing Leather Dyes-standard & 200 series except white & ….pdf

Edited January 18, 2016 by EdT

[mtaylor]

Remco,

 

Yoiu might give some thought to touching up using an archival black pen.   I've seen some others use this to cover.  I can't say it's perfect and will stay black, however.  I did use one on my Triton cross-section where some of the ebony was "blotchy"... not pure black, and so far it seems to be staying black but it's only been 5 years on that.

[Piet]

When all is said and done, the oil needs to be removed first before any kind of dye can penetrate the wood.  I'm sure that Remco may already have figured out a process to do that.  Permanent India drawing ink would be an excellent "dye." 

Paint is of course a solution but knowing Remco not really acceptable unless as a very last resort.

 

Hang in there Remco, I'm sure there will be a satisfactory solution you'll be happy with.

 

Cheers,

[Gaetan Bordeleau]

I have stopped using dyes. I tried  many kinds and inks but I never was 100% satisfied.

I use the water-based wood stain that my wife use for his hobby.

 

http://www.saman.ca/products/22-saman-water-based-stain

 

and there is  the American  standard

 

http://www.michaels.com/search?q=americana

 

 

Both apply the same way. Look like paint but is transparent as a dye.

The application is more homogeneous than dyes are.

[EdT]

Gaetan, I looked up the product you recommend.  It is a solvent based carbon black, pigmented stain.  It does not appear to have any binder, so it works as a non-fading black dye.  Looks like a good choice to me.

 

Piet, I would not be very optimistic about removing oil (tung, linseed, whatever) that has penetrated the wood.  Once this has penetrated and dried - in fact polymerized - the oil becomes impervious to most solvents and almost impossible to get out, especially if the finish is made from oils that have been boiled (cross-linked).  There is, of course, sandpaper, but that seems extreme and risky.

 

Ed

[druxey]

Ed, I once successfully sanded a wale after masking off the planking above and below with tape for safety. Hopefully any polymerized oil has not penetrated too far into a dense, close-grained hardwood. 

[Remcohe]

Thanks all for your advise and especially Ed for your research. I added a pic showing the 'problem' a bit better. Under normal light conditions it's very obvious, it just doesn't show very clear on a picture unless I over expose it.

 

 

I dare not use any solvents for the risk of letting the dye getting into places I really don't want it to be or dissolve glue. I could try to carefully scrape the topcoat of the tung oil and hope the Fieblings will penetrate the wood. But this also has the risk it might get into places where it shouldn't go. Let me sleep on it for a couple of nights

 

Remco

[amateur]

Ouch, that's more serious than it looked in the previous pics.

Is it the oil/stain layer that is rubbing off, and therefore discoulouring the wood,

or is it the stain discolouring under the oil-topcoat?

In this pic it looks as if the 'discoloured patches' are less shiny than their surroundings.

 

And do you have any idea how far the oil/stain penetrated the wood? In other words: can you use a scraping steel to remove the top layer, or do you loose too much material by that?

 

Jan

Edited January 21, 2016 by amateur

[Remcohe]

Jan, it's the stain discolouring below the oil topcoat. The shininess is just coincidence how the light fell. I have no idea how far the stain and the oil penetrated the wood. I only know I added multiple layers of stain and in the beginning it was very dark brown with no lighter patches what so ever.

 

Remco

[Burroak]

an instructor one time at a finishing class I took, show mixing dye with ting oil and then applying to the wood. The stain doesn't penetrate as deeply though. I don't know if you used maple or not, but it has hard and soft spots which causes blotches to form when stained.

[EdT]

Remco,  I agree it looks more pronounced in the latest picture, but not unlike a semi-transparent presentation that shows some wood grain.  If the wale was uniformly dark before applying the oil, it is likely that the oil leached some stain out of the wood.  This would not be surprising considering that the Fiebings is a solvent borne stain.  This effect would be worsened if a Tung oil "finish" was used as opposed to pure Tung oil.  Both could leach solvent-borne stains but the word "finish" usually implies the addition of solvent driers to the mix.  This would increase the tendency to dissolve the stain. I have experienced this problem on furniture finishing with penetrating oils on stained wood and finally adopted a surface finish (wipe-on poly) preceded buy a thin shellac seal coat to fix the stain on this type of work.

 

 If you want pure black on the wale, why add oil?  You could protect the underlying stain and add the desired level of gloss with a surface finish like rubbed shellac or varnish.   Wipe on poly could be used but that wiping might also pull out the color.  I used acrylic ink on Naiad with some transparency.  Nothing short of acetone or the like will leach that out - or effect the level of transparency.  Shellac based India ink will also resist oil (but not alcohol) topcoats.

 

Druxey's sanding solution may remove enough wood to get below the oil and allow the wale to be re-stained, but I would be afraid that non-uniform oil penetration depth may leave you with light spots when re-staining.

 

The presence of the oil topcoat will be difficult to cover with a non-oil based finish, so unless you want to use an oil-based paint over the existing finish, you may be in for some sanding.  After that I would consider staining with something like acrylic or India Ink followed by oil, shellac, wipe-on poly or a varnish, but whether to repair or how to do it is something you will need to decide and be comfortable with.

 

I would make just one recommendation if you decide on a repair.  Duplicate the problem on some scrap wood, following the identical sanding and finishing process used on the model.  Then test your proposed fix on that before doing anything to the model.

 

Hope this helps.  Finishing is always risky.

 

Ed