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Licorne 1755 by mtaylor - 3/16" scale - French Frigate - from Hahn plans - Version 2.0 - TERMINATED


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It must be a good feeling to get to this point Mark - sort of confirmation that you made the right decision. :)

 

I suspect March will seem to be a loooong month!

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It must be a good feeling to get to this point Mark - sort of confirmation that you made the right decision. :)

 

I suspect March will seem to be a loooong month!

 

Thanks Grant.  It is a good feeling.

 

March AND April.  Jeff has mine scheduled for late April...  In the meantime, I'm slogging on with some odds and ends.  I'm attempting a ship's boat (if successful or not, pics will follow) and will probably turn the cannon but not make carriages until needed. 

 

Oh.. spring has sprung here so there's some work I hope to get done outside so I don't have to do it after the wood arrives.  :)

Mark
"The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me

Current Build:                                                                                             
Past Builds:
 La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD           Triton Cross-Section   

 NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit                                                                            HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64               

 

Non-Ship Model:                                                                                         On hold, maybe forever:           

CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed                                                   Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned)         

         

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

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And we're off!!

 

This is so exciting! =)

-Adam

 

Current Builds

Santa Maria - Artesania Latina (1:65) POB

MayFlower - Model Shipways (5/32"=1') POB
Blue Shadow - Mamoli Revolutionary War Brigantine. (Fict) (1:64) POB (Recommissioned as the Kara June)

 

On The Shelf Waiting so Patiently

USRC Ranger - Corel (1:50) POB

18th Century Longboat - Model Shipways (1:4) POF

La Nina - Artesania Latina (1:65) POB

U.S Brig Syren - Model Shipways (1:64) POB

 

Completed Builds

Phantom NY Pilot Boat - Model Shipways (1:96) Solid Hull

 

Decommissioned Builds
(Time and conditions were not good to these. They have been cancelled =( )

Willie L Bennett - Model Shipways (1:32) POF
USRC Harriet Lane - Model Shipways (1:128) Solid Hull

 

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This ship's boat business is giving me serious pause for reflection.  I at first thought: "Well, I've got a couple of the ME low-budget ship's boat kits...."   But they are too generic and not right.  If I'm going to do this, I'm going to do it right.

 

This first pic shows the kit boat with a new keel I thought I'd use...

 

post-76-0-34512900-1394464176_thumb.jpg

 

So it's in the scrap box...

 

I dug through Frolich's book, re-examined the plans, and also looked at the Bonhomme Richard plans.  Seems the French pretty much standardized what boats and sized them accordingly.  I dug some more on the best way to do this... Frolich, Bello, various builds here on MSW, etc.  Ah-ha!!! Lifts!

 

After scaling the plans appropriately for all three boats, I generated a set of lifts for the longboat.  The barge and cutter will follow if this works.  :)   The other alternative is to generate a series of bulkheads/frames like Chuck designed for his boats but I'm trying the lifts first.  The one thing that I'll change between the plans and the build is the framing wood dimension.  The plans show the frames to be 1/32" X 1/32" (~0.5 mm).. I've tried but I can't cut wood that small, so I'll be using 1/16" X 1/16"(~1 mm) for the frames.  Here's where I am now... cutting out the lifts on wood of the appropriate thickness.  There's also a small pile of cherry cut to the frame size and a wide strip for the keel, etc.

 

post-76-0-20539900-1394464178_thumb.jpg

 

Now to go see where this path leads.... 

Mark
"The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me

Current Build:                                                                                             
Past Builds:
 La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD           Triton Cross-Section   

 NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit                                                                            HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64               

 

Non-Ship Model:                                                                                         On hold, maybe forever:           

CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed                                                   Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned)         

         

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

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Hi Mark -

 

Best of success with the small boat.  Since you are using a lift method for their hulls, here is a tip from Dynamite Payson that I have used with good success:  You probably know it already, but if not, it's one to add to your toolbox.

 

Once you have carved the outer shape of the boat, get a strong light source and hold the boat up to it as you carve the inner shape.  When it starts to get to the right thickness you will see light coming through.  The strength of the light will show you where you have different thicknesses of wood and where you have to thin it some more.

 

Hope that helps.

 

Dan

Current build -SS Mayaguez (c.1975) scale 1/16" = 1' (1:192) by Dan Pariser

 

Prior scratch builds - Royal yacht Henrietta, USS Monitor, USS Maine, HMS Pelican, SS America, SS Rex, SS Uruguay, Viking knarr, Gokstad ship, Thames River Skiff , USS OneidaSwan 42 racing yacht  Queen Anne's Revenge (1710) SS Andrea Doria (1952), SS Michelangelo (1962) , Queen Anne's Revenge (2nd model) USS/SS Leviathan (1914),  James B Colgate (1892),  POW bone model (circa 1800) restoration

 

Prior kit builds - AL Dallas, Mamoli Bounty. Bluejacket America, North River Diligence, Airfix Sovereign of the Seas

 

"Take big bites.  Moderation is for monks."  Robert A. Heinlein

 

 

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Thanks for the encouragement, guys.

 

Thanks for the tip, Dan.  Actually, I'm using the lifts to make a mold. I'll add the frames, keel, and planking to it and then remove it from the mold.

Mark
"The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me

Current Build:                                                                                             
Past Builds:
 La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD           Triton Cross-Section   

 NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit                                                                            HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64               

 

Non-Ship Model:                                                                                         On hold, maybe forever:           

CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed                                                   Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned)         

         

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

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Hi Mark, using Chuck's bulkhead frame system I  also found reducing the thickness of boxwood frames  @1:64 scale to less than 1mm made them too fragile. I am making the ones for my Pinnace from 1.5mm thick sheet but will them sand down to 1mm. Once insitu and held by the planking I may be able to reduce the width a little more, but getting down to around 0.5mm is a tall order.

 

I am very interested to see how you get on with your boats.

 

Speaking of French boats, it seems eminently sensible to build them to nest, unlike the British Navy where there were far more sizes and shapes most of which were unsuitable for nesting. On the other hand it must have been a hell of an exercise to get at the Longboat having to remove the cutter and Barge first.

 

Cheers,

 

B.E.

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Mark -

 

That should work well, given your usual excellent workmanship.  Looking forward to seeing it.

 

Dan

Current build -SS Mayaguez (c.1975) scale 1/16" = 1' (1:192) by Dan Pariser

 

Prior scratch builds - Royal yacht Henrietta, USS Monitor, USS Maine, HMS Pelican, SS America, SS Rex, SS Uruguay, Viking knarr, Gokstad ship, Thames River Skiff , USS OneidaSwan 42 racing yacht  Queen Anne's Revenge (1710) SS Andrea Doria (1952), SS Michelangelo (1962) , Queen Anne's Revenge (2nd model) USS/SS Leviathan (1914),  James B Colgate (1892),  POW bone model (circa 1800) restoration

 

Prior kit builds - AL Dallas, Mamoli Bounty. Bluejacket America, North River Diligence, Airfix Sovereign of the Seas

 

"Take big bites.  Moderation is for monks."  Robert A. Heinlein

 

 

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We all knew you would find a way to keep the yard operational whilst awaiting your lumber.

Augie

 

Current Build: US Frigate Confederacy - MS 1:64

 

Previous Builds :

 

US Brig Syren (MS) - 2013 (see Completed Ship Gallery)

Greek Tug Ulises (OcCre) - 2009 (see Completed Ship Gallery)

Victory Cross Section (Corel) - 1988

Essex (MS) 1/8"- 1976

Cutty Sark (Revell 1:96) - 1956

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I'm looking forward to seeing the little boats evolve Mark.

 

Michael

Current builds  Bristol Pilot Cutter 1:8;      Skipjack 19 foot Launch 1:8;       Herreshoff Buzzards Bay 14 1:8

Other projects  Pilot Cutter 1:500 ;   Maria, 1:2  Now just a memory    

Future model Gill Smith Catboat Pauline 1:8

Finished projects  A Bassett Lowke steamship Albertic 1:100  

 

Anything you can imagine is possible, when you put your mind to it.

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Mark,

 

what are you thinking ?

 

The Licorne is to big I'm gonna change to a small one ??????

Practicing makes art ?????

Make a lot of pictures please....not for me but for Anja .

She can use it when she goes (whenever ) build the Hannah  :D

 

animaatjes-sjors-94584.gif

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Hi Mark

 

Having recently acquired Frolich's book myself,I followed his leed by using a small solid block in the construction of Caroline's launch.It sits forward of the transom in the base of the hull.This helped a great deal to overcome the double curvature of the frames just forward of the rudder and is covered up when the interior is fitted out.

Regarding joint lines,Dr Mike discarded black paper in his DVD,stating that all black paper was of too good a quality for glue penetration,he used the cheapest quality white paper available and dyed it with black ink.Messing about,yes,but it does make a lot of sense.

 

Kind Regards

 

Nigel

Currently working on Royal Caroline

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Thanks for the comments.  Hmm... now I am pressured by all the confidence expressed. :)

 

Hi Mark, using Chuck's bulkhead frame system I  also found reducing the thickness of boxwood frames  @1:64 scale to less than 1mm made them too fragile. I am making the ones for my Pinnace from 1.5mm thick sheet but will them sand down to 1mm. Once insitu and held by the planking I may be able to reduce the width a little more, but getting down to around 0.5mm is a tall order.

 

I am very interested to see how you get on with your boats.

 

Speaking of French boats, it seems eminently sensible to build them to nest, unlike the British Navy where there were far more sizes and shapes most of which were unsuitable for nesting. On the other hand it must have been a hell of an exercise to get at the Longboat having to remove the cutter and Barge first.

 

Cheers,

 

B.E.

 

B.E.

Frolich actually cuts the frames from a slab of wood. post-76-0-81996400-1394563779.gif  I just feel I know my limits at this point so I'll be doing the best I can at this point.  I may try Chuck's method if this fails.

 

 

Mark,

 

what are you thinking ?

 

The Licorne is to big I'm gonna change to a small one ??????

Practicing makes art ?????

Make a lot of pictures please....not for me but for Anja .

She can use it when she goes (whenever ) build the Hannah  :D

 

animaatjes-sjors-94584.gif

 

Sjors,

I'm building the small boats that go onto Licorne's deck.  I'm still waiting on the wood for the framing.  I'll be posting pictures even if this is a failure, although I feel pretty good about how it's going.

 

Hi Mark

 

Having recently acquired Frolich's book myself,I followed his leed by using a small solid block in the construction of Caroline's launch.It sits forward of the transom in the base of the hull.This helped a great deal to overcome the double curvature of the frames just forward of the rudder and is covered up when the interior is fitted out.

Regarding joint lines,Dr Mike discarded black paper in his DVD,stating that all black paper was of too good a quality for glue penetration,he used the cheapest quality white paper available and dyed it with black ink.Messing about,yes,but it does make a lot of sense.

 

Kind Regards

 

Nigel

 

Thanks Nigel.  Frolich, Bello and some of the others that I reference do beautiful work and I'm studying how they did it.  I like the idea of the solid piece shaped and I can see having two as he shows.. one aft and one forward at the bow. 

 

I have the mold lifts cut out and glued together so today will be spent shaping it.   For the mold, I'm using basswood since the experts said to use a "soft piece of wood".   After shaping, I'll coat it with a couple coats of diluted white glue, some wipe-on poly and then furniture polish.  But gotta' get it shaped first. post-76-0-27861600-1394564168.gif  

Mark
"The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me

Current Build:                                                                                             
Past Builds:
 La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD           Triton Cross-Section   

 NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit                                                                            HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64               

 

Non-Ship Model:                                                                                         On hold, maybe forever:           

CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed                                                   Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned)         

         

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

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I'm gonna watch this with a great deal of interest, never seen it done before.

 

Good luck Mark although you wont need it, you've seem to have it pretty well covered and you have a lot of expert help ready in the wings.

 

Be Good

 

mobbsie

mobbsie
All mistakes are deliberate ( me )


Current Build:- HMS Schooner Pickle

 

Completed Builds :-   Panart 1/16 Armed Launch / Pinnace ( Completed ),  Granado Cross Section 1/48

Harwich Bawley, Restoration,  Thames Barge Edme, Repair / Restoration,  Will Everard 1/67 Billings 

HMS Agamemnon 1781 - 1/64 Caldercraft KitHM Brig Badger,  HM Bomb Vessel Granado,
Thames Steam Launch Louise,  Thames Barge Edme,  Viking Dragon Boat


Next Build :-  

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I'm gonna watch this with a great deal of interest, never seen it done before.

 

mobbsie

 

That makes two of us, Mobbsie.   I've only seen it in books.  It should be fun and interesting now that I've sorted out what's to be done. 

Mark
"The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me

Current Build:                                                                                             
Past Builds:
 La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD           Triton Cross-Section   

 NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit                                                                            HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64               

 

Non-Ship Model:                                                                                         On hold, maybe forever:           

CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed                                                   Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned)         

         

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

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The mold is almost done.   I cut out the lifts and glued them together then sanded and shaped and sanded some more.  I'm in the process of cutting in the slots for the stem, keel, and stempost.

 

The first figure shows how I jigged up a sled on the saw and cut the slot using a 1/16" dado washer.  MM doesn't do dado blades, you add an appropriate washer next to blade and since the washer is cut on an angle, the blade is angled and cuts a slot.    The rest of the pictures show the mold with the slots cut and being cleaned up.  There's still more work on the mold before I start laying the frames.

 

It's a fun but nerve-wracking process (to me at least) as I'm in unknown territory here. 

 

post-76-0-73484400-1394758318_thumb.jpg

post-76-0-52546100-1394758321_thumb.jpg

post-76-0-55846200-1394758324_thumb.jpg

 

 

Mark
"The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me

Current Build:                                                                                             
Past Builds:
 La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD           Triton Cross-Section   

 NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit                                                                            HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64               

 

Non-Ship Model:                                                                                         On hold, maybe forever:           

CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed                                                   Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned)         

         

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

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Looks good Mark; some great progress on this mini-project- but it is too small to throw the popcorn at; especially from the back rows! :)

 

cheers

 

Pat

If at first you do not suceed, try, and then try again!
Current build: HMCSS Victoria (Scratch)

Next build: HMAS Vampire (3D printed resin, scratch 1:350)

Built:          Battle Station (Scratch) and HM Bark Endeavour 1768 (kit 1:64)

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that is so cool Mark!  never done this before......I'll be watching ;)

I yam wot I yam!

finished builds:
Billings Nordkap 476 / Billings Cux 87 / Billings Mary Ann / Billings AmericA - reissue
Billings Regina - bashed into the Susan A / Andrea Gail 1:20 - semi scratch w/ Billing instructions
M&M Fun Ship - semi scratch build / Gundalow - scratch build / Jeanne D'Arc - Heller
Phylly C & Denny-Zen - the Lobsie twins - bashed & semi scratch dual build

Billing T78 Norden

 

in dry dock:
Billing's Gothenborg 1:100 / Billing's Boulogne Etaples 1:20
Billing's Half Moon 1:40 - some scratch required
Revell U.S.S. United States 1:96 - plastic/ wood modified / Academy Titanic 1:400
Trawler Syborn - semi scratch / Holiday Harbor dual build - semi scratch

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When you start putting frames/keel etc into that, how do you stop it sticking to the mold while gluing the joints?

I thinking treating the mold with oil might do it? or is that what the furniture polish will do? I only ask because my construction technique involves glue getting all over the place.....

 

Cheers

Rob

Edited by robbl

Current build: HMS Blanche 1800, Scratch POF

 

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Take a piece of wax and melt it over the form and rub it in.  This is the usual practice.  The glue will stick to the wax and make it easier to remove.

David B

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Hi Mark,

 

The first figure shows how I jigged up a sled on the saw and cut the slot using a 1/16" dado washer.

 

 

I don't have dado washers - I just make an extra cut or two by moving the fence until I get the required width of cut.

 

:cheers:  Danny

Cheers, Danny

________________________________________________________________________________
Current Build :    Forced Retirement from Modelling due to Health Issues

Build Logs :   Norfolk Sloop  HMS Vulture - (TFFM)  HMS Vulture Cross-section  18 foot Cutter    Concord Stagecoach   18th Century Longboat in a BOTTLE 

CARD Model Build Logs :   Mosel   Sydney Opera House (Schreiber-Bogen)   WWII Mk. IX Spitfire (Halinski)  Rolls Royce Merlin Engine  Cape Byron Lighthouse (HMV)       Stug 40 (Halinski)    Yamaha MT-01   Yamaha YA-1  HMS Hood (Halinski)  Bismarck (GPM)  IJN Amatsukaze 1940 Destroyer (Halinski)   HMVS Cerberus   Mi24D Hind (Halinski)  Bulgar Steam Locomotive - (ModelikTanker and Beer Wagons (Modelik)  Flat Bed Wagon (Modelik)  Peterbuilt Semi Trailer  Fender Guitar  

Restorations for Others :  King of the Mississippi  HMS Victory
Gallery : Norfolk Sloop,   HMAT Supply,   HMS Bounty,   HMS Victory,   Charles W. Morgan,   18' Cutter for HMS Vulture,   HMS Vulture,  HMS Vulture Cross-section,             18th Century Longboat in a Bottle 

Other Previous Builds : Le Mirage, Norske Love, King of the Mississippi

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Thanks for the "likes" and gentle commentary everyone.

 

that is so cool Mark!  never done this before......I'll be watching ;)

 

I haven't done it before either, Denis.   :)

 

When you start putting frames/keel etc into that, how do you stop it sticking to the mold while gluing the joints?

I thinking treating the mold with oil might do it? or is that what the furniture polish will do? I only ask because my construction technique involves glue getting all over the place.....

 

Cheers

Rob

 

Rob,

I hit it with 2 coats of wipe on poly. Heavy coats at that.  Then I put on 2 coats of furniture polish.  On my test piece, nothing stuck to it.

 

Hi Mark,

 

 

I don't have dado washers - I just make an extra cut or two by moving the fence until I get the required width of cut.

 

:cheers:  Danny

 

It's a pity there's no dado blades (I double checked the Thurston catalog), or the washers for the Byrnes saw.  You do a fantastic job of it, Danny.   

 

Well, after almost a week of sorting out this mold and testing poly and wax for glue rejection, and I won't even get into water supply issues and spring yard work,  the mold is ready.

 

It's been treated as I told Rob (up above) and glued to the base.  I have some, but not enough, cherry soaking to make the frames.  I'm headed off across the room to cut some from strips.... hopefully, tomorrow I can start actually building the longboat.

 

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Mark
"The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me

Current Build:                                                                                             
Past Builds:
 La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD           Triton Cross-Section   

 NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit                                                                            HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64               

 

Non-Ship Model:                                                                                         On hold, maybe forever:           

CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed                                                   Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned)         

         

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

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Nice work.  When using my Preac I would gang different blades together to get the correct width.

David B

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Looks like a fun project Mark.

Dripped wax, furniture polish, bees wax, they should all work as a release for the glue. 

That is a pretty small dado, how flat is it using the washer method? I would imagine its reasonably flat? I used a wobble dado set on a 10" table saw, once, didnt care for the noise or the slight curve on the bottom. 

Sam

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Current Build Constructo Enterprise

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