Shipping Costs

[Goodshipvenus]

I needed additional brass pins for my Sphinx model and I found that only Modelcraft pins will fit the Modelcraft pin pusher. So I found them on the Modelcraft web site for $3.75. Fair price. But, they wanted $16.95 for shipping, 4 1/2 times the cost of a product that weighs less than an ounce and could be shipped in an envelope with a first class stamp! Instead I found the same item on a modeling website and was only charged $10.95 for shipping! This seems to be a common issue for online sites when you need just one or two small hobby items.

Now I don’t expect a small retailer to provide free shipping like Amazon, but charging many times more for shipping than the cost of the product is just robbery. 
Have other members encountered this same issue?

[barkeater]

I have had the same problem. It has shied me away from some suppliers who are out of line in their shipping.

[Roger Pellett]

It's possible that some suppliers have learned from Telemarketers:

 

"But wait there's more!  If you call right now, we'll send you another one free! Just pay separate processing and handling."

 

If you charge enough for shipping, the product is free.

[Peanut6]

I've experienced this also.  I've come to believe that this a way for them to make up for "such a great deal" they are offering their customers.  And remember, the vendor is still making money on every item no matter what the price is.  

[mtaylor]

Not trying to highjack this but one thing to consider is having a build log.  Many of us have had issues and needed replacement parts or supplies and more than a few times, other members have reached out and offered such.    In this case, I'm not using those pins so I would have been happy to drop them in an envelope.

[JohnLea]

Shipping is a profit center for many retailers.

[Chuck]

15 hours ago, Goodshipvenus said:

Fair price. But, they wanted $16.95 for shipping, 4 1/2 times the cost of a product that weighs less than an ounce and could be shipped in an envelope with a first class stamp!

This is simply not true.  At least not in the USA.  All commercial products must be mailed and shipped at the parcel price.  The USPS will not allow any product to be shipped by a known commercial seller just an an envelope.  I know first hand because I have tried.   Many dont know this and the seller would face stiff penalties and or refusal to ship from the Post Office if caught.  Sorry but you are just wrong.  One reason is that any stiff items will jam the new sorting machines.   Only envelopes can be put in them and they bend through the machine rollers.  When you put anything hard or metal in the envelopes it jams the machines and believe me you hear about it if you are a commercial shipper.

 

Parcels are NOT put through sorting machines like the envelopes are...or they are put through different ones not likely to jam.

 

In the US the cheapest parcel rate for commercial shipping is around $5.50  Up to 8 oz.  If its going international it varies...but you are looking at $14 - $22.   The cheaper number is basically just Canada.  I have had angry emails that shipping 1package of large triple blocks which cost $6 when sent to Europe would cost $22 to ship.   I get called a crook all the time.   But folks are just so wrong and have no idea how it works for a small business.

 

No way around this unless you are Amazon and get a huge break from the post office.  Small guys have to pay full rate every time.  So any of you guys in the US that get angry about not using a first class stamp to mail a few packages of blocks or rope....or "brass pins", please understand that this is not 1950....you cant do that any more.  

 

Now if that guy is charging $16 to ship within the same country like the USA he is absolutely ripping you off.  But $7 - $10 is pretty standard to cover packaging etc.  Unless you are Jeff Bezos.

[Gregory]

Don't forget, they call it "Shipping and Handling. "

 

The retailers time and materials have to be figured in to the cost of doing business.   A small item is not necessarily easier and cheaper to package and ship.

 

Also putting yourself into a niche such as " certain pins only work with certain  tools " opens the door for limited access.

[glbarlow]

 

 

58 minutes ago, Chuck said:

 But folks are just so wrong and have no idea how it works for a small business

Good explanation Chuck, thanks. 
 

I don’t buy from any company over charging for shipping, $16.95 is clearly a rip off. There is a small hobby store in Florida that has a minimum $15.95 shipping, I can get the same item from another small company in California for $5.95, it pays to shop around. 
 

I have found in many cases, though probably not for proprietary mini-nails, I can find the same or similar product on Amazon. Aside from the bulk power of Amazon, companies offering “free shipping” have it built into the price, nothing is ever free. The best I can do is buy multiple items from companies charging a reasonable shipping fee to get the most from my shipping dollar. 

[Peanut6]

Gregory I agree with you, all costs of doing business must be factured into the end item delivery total.  And sole source providers hold the key to the city.  My issue comes with the practice of shipping and handling fees based upon item price and how that can be applied to a multiple item purchase.  Maybe this example might clarify my point.  Let's say you want to purchase 2 items from Company "X".  Company "X" charges a $10 shipping and handling for items up to $30.  The total purchase price of the 2 items you want is $25.  You would think, and common sense would dictate, that your total price would be $10 (shipping and handling fee) + $25 (total cost of items) = $35.  But no, the total price is $45, because Company "X" wants every penny they can squeeze out of you, $10 (shipping and handling fee for item 1) + $10 (shipping and handling fee for item 2) + $25 (total cost of items) = $45.  Now comes the funny part, when the items are delivered what do you get?  Two separate packages or both items in a single package.  Our household has experienced both endings and we no longer do business with those companies.    

Edited April 22, 2022 by Peanut6
typo

[amateur]

You learn something new every day.....

 

In Europe things are a bit different (mainland, at least): there the postal services can handle a kind of in-between type of mail: the 'rather stiff, not completely bendable stuff', you can use the famous padded envelopes for that. Not as shock proof as a full size package, but transported at nomal postage rates. Ideal for sending booklets, metal pins, and card-models. (and certainly much cheaper for both seller and buyer than a full-size cardbox).

(but usually the damage risk is at the buyers end)

 

Jan

 

[rshousha]

It's amazing how many people come to me, wondering why there are fewer and fewer suppliers of spare parts. 

 

 

 

[shipman]

Here in the UK, since 'Brexit', anything mailed from mainland Europe, postage suddenly doubled or quadrupled.

Some sellers won't even consider doing business with UK customers.

Frequently items within the UK are shipped free, even if the item costs £1-£2!

Buying ANYTHING transatlantic is a no no.

[JohnLea]

My experience is from 15-20 years ago.  At that time, I was able to ship Priority Mail and charged the actual cost.  At the same time, I would be receiving items that were definitely shipped "cost plus".  Even allowing for handling, many times it seemed excessive.   I haven't shipped retail since 2009 and if I remember, the PO was in the process of changing things up around then.  At that time, I was pondering adding a charge for having to stand in long lines at the PO.

[jhearl]

Earlier this week, I sent some small pieces of wood to a friend in another state. (Nothing commercial about it - just a friend-to-friend thing.) They wouldn't fit in a regular envelope, so I put them in a padded CD mailer. That's about 6" square. The wood was very light and the whole package probably weighed only a couple of ounces. Took it to the post office and the clerk asked if it needed to get there in a hurry. I told him no - it could ship the cheapest way. The price? $10.30!!  We were both floored but he swore that was the right price. As I stood there, I looked at the display of "If it fits, it ships" envelopes, I saw there was one considerably larger than my CD mailer and it was $8.95, which was the cheapest mailer they have. I asked if I could just put my envelope right into one of those mailers and he said, "Sure."  So for $1.35 less, the package was sent priority mail to arrive in 2 days, had a tracking number, and $50 insurance.  Crazy.

 

[chris watton]

My wife just posted a packet of fine brass pins to a customer in the US, and the exact postage cost was £4.20.

 

Not every company inflate postage charges to customers. In fact, due to a bug in the UPS live module we use, we have supplemented the shipping of every Sphinx kit to the US by at least £5 - so not everyone is 'out to get ya'.

[Edwardkenway]

I've had parts and wood from both the USA and mainland Europe,  and the shipping cost was roughly the same when converted to GBP from $ or € approx £24, the only difference was the duty/VAT to be paid on the US  package.

As I could not get what I wanted here in the UK, I was happy to pay the shipping. 

Just my tuppence worth (shipped free🙄)

[James H]

17 hours ago, shipman said:

Buying ANYTHING transatlantic is a no no.

 

I was told by an insider at a main hub where customs are assessed in UK, is that just about everything from the US is held up for customs to get their £ out of you, while from anywhere else (including China and Japan), it's quite arbitrary. 

[bruce d]

One thing that sometimes pops up in the UK is the 'invoice' from the carrier that demands about £40 for administrative fees incurred in getting the parcel through customs.

I refuse and so far have had no consequences despite a couple of sabre-rattles. 

My reason is this: I ordered items from China and paid the quoted p&p, then paid the UK duties and charges. I have never engaged directly with the carrier (a big, well known company) and had no contract with them. If they are going to charge anyone for services, it can only be the person/company that engaged their services. In my case I checked with the vendor who was unaware of any further charges beyond those he had agreed and paid.

It is just something they do with commercial traffic and I believe no unsuspecting member of the public should be sucked in to the practice. 

Grumble over. 

[Ian_Grant]

One thing I have run into several times is excessive shipping fees from USA to me in Canada. I don't know why USPS is so expensive into Canada.

 

For example, when I wanted to buy a Heller "Preussen" kit, it was significantly cheaper to pay postage from France than from Connecticut. I could drive to Connecticut in a day 🤔.

 

Books too. I have ordered several ship books from the UK instead of the USA for the same reason.

 

And small parts. It's often cheaper for me to order from Model Dockyard or CMB in the UK, than from say MS in the USA.

 

Just sayin'

[Gregory]

16 minutes ago, Ian_Grant said:

One thing I have run into several times is excessive shipping fees from USA to me in Canada.

Interesting because the shipping cost I have incurred from Crafty Sailor in Canada seems very reasonable for small items like hooks.. I think it was $4.99

[Ian_Grant]

Gregory, are you in the USA?  Maybe it's ok in that direction.

 

Thanks for mentioning Crafty Sailor in Calgary - I never heard of them before, LOL.  Their rope certainly comes in many sizes!  Will keep them in mind from now on.

[Gregory]

Yes, I'm in USA.

 

Crafty has some great PE eyebolts and hooks, as well as some thimbles that are hard to find anywhere else..

[James H]

On 4/23/2022 at 1:55 PM, bruce d said:

One thing that sometimes pops up in the UK is the 'invoice' from the carrier that demands about £40 for administrative fees incurred in getting the parcel through customs.

I refuse and so far have had no consequences despite a couple of sabre-rattles. 

My reason is this: I ordered items from China and paid the quoted p&p, then paid the UK duties and charges. I have never engaged directly with the carrier (a big, well known company) and had no contract with them. If they are going to charge anyone for services, it can only be the person/company that engaged their services. In my case I checked with the vendor who was unaware of any further charges beyond those he had agreed and paid.

It is just something they do with commercial traffic and I believe no unsuspecting member of the public should be sucked in to the practice. 

Grumble over. 

 

I used to do the same with ParcelForce. A good way of dealing with it was asking for the charge to be separated from the duty, and then the duty paid. The parcel was then released and when they then invoiced you for there fees, they couldn't legally enforce it (because you had to contract with them) and the invoice was binned.

 

ParcelForce then stopped that happening. I have never since had success in getting a package released from any courier without the fees being paid prior.  They hold your parcel and the 'third party' argument or the 'final mile' argument simply didn't work. 

 

If you know how this is bypassed, and I've spent so long navigating this problem, PLEASE let me know what you say/send etc. 

[BenD]

Shipping costs are a problem. I've been using Oversize letter-mail in Canada with success for around $2-$3. A tracked parcel in Canada is over $20... For US and international Canada post has decent rates with untracked air-mail usually for under $10 -200g. If I get a very small order I have been able to sneak them in regular letter-mail without issue. I only sell rope so I don't use boxes or have to ship things weighing in pounds so that keeps it cheap and easy.

[bruce d]

1 hour ago, James H said:

I have never since had success in getting a package released from any courier without the fees being paid prior.  They hold your parcel and the 'third party' argument or the 'final mile' argument simply didn't work. 

 

Both times it has happened to me the carrier was DHL. Perhaps their process is different because the bill for customs duty and tax arrived, I paid, the parcel was delivered and a few days later the DHL bill arrived. This is different from your description where it sounds like you ain't gettin' your parcel till they get their ££££.

For the record, I abbreviated the story a bit in my earlier post. Once was from China (CAFmodel, Tom was not aware) and once from the USA, and again the vendor was unaware of these further charges.

I believe the thing that swung it for me was taking the stance 'I have no contract with you, you have no right to demand payment from the addressee, who is effectively your customer's customer'.

 

HTH

[shipman]

I've had umpteen small value items from China, usually free postage and never incurred any additional charges.

Incredible really, when you consider they are at the other side of the planet.

Makes me wonder how they make any money at all.

[mnewsholme]

On 4/23/2022 at 1:34 PM, James H said:

 

I was told by an insider at a main hub where customs are assessed in UK, is that just about everything from the US is held up for customs to get their £ out of you, while from anywhere else (including China and Japan), it's quite arbitrary. 

I've received 3 separate deliveries from Syren in US over last month and not had to pay the dreaded import/VAT fees on any of them.

Guess I just got lucky 😉

 

I remember there was discussion a couple of years ago about suppliers having to pay UK VAT at source as part of costs and they were responsible for paying it to the UK HMRC but not sure if Chuck has implemented that. I remember having to pay import/VAT  on Syren imports in the past.

 

[shipman]

Just ordered a new switch for an angle poise lamp (online).

 

SHOCK HORROR...................£1.40. INCLUDING P&P.

[jimbyr]

Just did a quote for shipping to South Africa this morning,  a saw and sliding table,  $616.00,  UPS has gone wild.

 

Jim

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