Help for the Noobies

[drjeckl]

This is probably going to sound a little cynical and I hope that I don't get blackballed from this site.  But I have been spectacularly impressed with the wealth of experience and knowledge of the veterans that log into, maintain this site and comment/assist on build logs and other topics, all on their own time.  Bravo to all of you!!!  Couldn't live without this site.

 

However, (yeah there is a however), if one of the missions of this vehicle is to help the new-to-the-hobby, which I think it is, and which I am one of them, then I think there is could be some improvement needed on the part of the Moderators and/or some other group of veteran experts, in order reduce the elapsed time between submitting a request for help in a build log and getting a response.  Based on my count today, there are 210 x build logs that have not been responded to as far back as 5/2120 just in where I have posted my specific build log, updated on 09-Oct=20, here 

Build logs for SHIP MODEL KITS - by era - launch date

• Kit build logs for subjects built from 1751 - 1800 

I have not looked in other topics or forums, but my guess is the situation somewhat exists in those different timeframe forums as well.

 

Bottom Line:

What I'm hoping for is that management could put into place an official mentoring process for the Noobies; I joined in April, 2020.  This could take several forms and it's likely that this issue has been brought up in the past, so I won't throw out suggestions on how to to this.  If you want me to, I will.  Not sure how many members out there who are sympathetic to my proposition.

 

However, I'm sure I speak for others that are waiting fore a response, in their  build logs, to their 'plea' for help from the wizards at this site. on how to proceed.  I have gotten valuable responses when I have posted questions in specific forums, such as furniture fittings.  But I have not received  any comments in two weeks on my build log.

 

Just trying to make this a more useful site and give you my feedback...John

[Chuck]

That is a tough call.  If you dont get a response in your build log you may want

to reach out to some folks by PM and and ask them.  This is something we have been trying to improve but you must understand that with so many build logs.

 

Best to just ask one question at a time and not write really long posts.  Posing short questions are more likely to get a response

 

For me I know its tough to read every build log.  

 

Probably the most important thing is to mingle and also read, post and participate in the logs of others beyond just your own.  Folks are more likely to take an interest in you and reach out if you do the same.  A quick look at your history reveals that you only post in your own topics and never in those for others. 
 

This is a huge part of the issue.  I am sure it would be easier to get a response if you pose the question or have participated in the logs of others.  Especially those that are building the same kit or similar.  This is is best way to create a mentoring cross exchange of ideas.    
 

its not a one way street on any forum where one should expect members to flock to them without ever having taken the time to do the same on other members projects and topics.   As if it was a paid class or workshop.  This is just a community of mode builders where folks are having fun and making friends.  No paid teachers here.  
 

 

I hope this helps....If a member wont reach out to others they can hardly expect to get any traction and there is nothing any staff member can do to fix that!

 

So please try to participate in the logs and topics that are not your own as well.  Even if its to just say that others are doing a good job.  Probably the best advice I can give you.  That effort will pay off in multiples. 
 

These are just a few things I can suggest to you.  Ask yourself when was the last time you posted and took an interest in other projects outside of your own.  Just to say good work or ask how they are doing? We dont have paid mentors and those folks are very busy.  They have a many opportunities to help others but are most likely choosing to spend their time in logs where those folks also have shown an interest in their work.

 

Chuck

 

 

[James H]

[VTHokiEE]

 

46 minutes ago, Chuck said:

you may want to reach out to some folks by PM and and ask them.

 

I would definitely endorse this as well, I have reached out to members (who are currently active) and all have be very helpful.

 

I have also found it useful to post questions in their build logs (even if completed) of the same kit, or similar step, asking how they accomplished a certain step. 
 

Even when a log has some activity, and a following I’ve seen questions not always get answered. I hypothesize that this is due to people being humble about their knowledge so I usually butt my head into their logs 😁

[Chuck]

Very true, but you also post words of encouragement and just friendly comments about other folks progress as well.  
 

That is the key!!! And the point I was trying to emphasize.  The easiest way to get feedback and engagement is to get out of the “bubble” of your own build logs and topics.  Show an interest in others and others will show an interest in you.  Its pretty simple really.

 

I can not emphasize it enough.🥰  My mamma always said....show a little love and you will get a little love.  Show a lotta love and....

 

[Chuck]

7 hours ago, drjeckl said:

reduce the elapsed time between submitting a request for help in a build log and getting a response.  Based on my count today, there are 210 x build logs that have not been responded to

One thing I meant to reply to as well.  And dont take this personally.  But your are not submitting a REQUEST as if this site is some sort of paid hotline or workshop.  That is also a mindset that should never be taken.  
 

Again,  this is an unpaid community of like minded model builders.  They are not a customer service department.  If some are treating MSW like  a personal customer service hotline that wont help to make any friends.  
 

Engaging and developing friendships is the way to go.  Only creating “requests” for yourself or thinking about them as requests is also part of the issue.  I am speaking from experience here as a person who loves to help but with the dozens of “requests” from folks it sometimes feels a bit one sided.  Especially when at times, and more often than you might expect, you dont even get a thank you in return. You never hear back from some of these guys.  Thats why its easier to spread a little love with your requests.  
 

Not speaking about you at all but just making a personal observation based on actual experience here.   I am just letting other members know in order to help them if they are indeed in the same situation.   
 

Try to engage and give a little as well to the folks you are making requests with.  It makes it easier for some to not feel like the “volunteer ship model request hotline”.  
 

Once again I would ask yourself (and all members reading this). Those 210 build logs you mentioned....how many of them did you post words of encouragement in?  How many of them did you hit the like

button for?  I encourage you and all others to do the best you can to engage and answer in these 210 logs regardless of your level of expertise.  Rather than just hope others will do so in your own logs.

 

Just think about that for a second.  
 

Mean no offense by this but you guys know how important this topic is to me.   The “2 build log challenge”.  And if you dont know what the "2 build log" challenge is then you probably havent ventured outside of your own build log bubble that much.
 

For the best experience in any community....mingle a little bit.  Its so much harder to be asked to dance when you are a wallflower.

[glbarlow]

Totally agree with Chuck and VHT.  On my signature line below you’ll see a link to my completed Lady Nelson, by clicking on I hope you’ll find some helpful information for your own build. So the first suggestion is to use the search function to find other build logs of your same model. Often you’ll find not only answers to your questions but answers you didn’t know you needed. I use several completed logs to see how past builders accomplished certain tasks on my current Cheerful before I start that same task. Leveraging the ideas of others is one of the best parts of the forum.

 

Were you to comment on my Lady Nelson build I’d likely reciprocate by checking out yours, this back and forth is how communities are built of people of similar interests and my second suggestion. In fact VHT and I are in a shared community which started when I searched for builders of HM Alert. The key to this is using the signature option in settings to add a hyperlink to your build log in your signature line which is then included in every post.

 

We aren’t ignoring you, we just don’t know you’re there. With just 27 posts, and none on any other build log, how would we. I’ll go check your log. Have a look at my Nelson log. 
 

Bottom line, it’s on you to build your community, not “management.”

[glbarlow]

17 minutes ago, Chuck said:

 I am speaking from experience here as a person who loves to help

Once again I agree.  I always try to thank everyone who comments on my log because I appreciate the time they took to do it..  That’s best done by the quote selection option Chuck and I just used because that creates a notification back to the poster that he has a reply.  It’s all about being active and having conversations, not a request line.

[bruce d]

7 minutes ago, glbarlow said:

We aren’t ignoring you, we just don’t know you’re there. With just 27 posts, and none on any other build log, how would we.

In my opinion, that is the whole story in a nutshell.

[JpR62]

Another key is research in the various build logs of this forum.
The problems you are having probably someone has already had it and has probably provided the solution in their build log.
I spent and still spend many hours going through the logs to find different solutions and tips. It is never wasted time and is well worth it.
This forum is a wealth of information 😀
You really have to be curious and not hesitate to look for information..

 

[James H]

I've pinned this topic for future reference.

[MEDDO]

I definitely agree with this advice.  This forum is so big that new posts get pushed off the front page so fast many will not see them.  Chucks 2 build log challenge is a great way for some of the people who have been here for a while to get some visibility on some of the new builders.  Even a quick "great job" comment does help encourage the builder.  Responding to them with a simple thanks in your build log helps complete the circle.  It gets even better if you go to their build logs and start leaving likes and comments.  The circle gets bigger...

 

As Chuck said

4 hours ago, Chuck said:

I can not emphasize it enough.🥰  My mamma always said....show a little love and you will get a little love.  Show a lotta love and....

 

 

p.s. Also linking you current build in you signature makes it significantly easier to people to get to your log.  For the original poster I know you are working on the Lady Nelson but with no link I have to now go to the search box and search for your log along with all the other Lady Nelson logs.  A link in the signature makes it so much easier

[drjeckl]

All,

I really appreciate the advice. 

2 hours ago, Chuck said:

That is the key!!! And the point I was trying to emphasize.  The easiest way to get feedback and engagement is to get out of the “bubble” of your own build logs and topics.  Show an interest in others and others will show an interest in you.  Its pretty simple really.

 I get it, although it is somewhat intimidating to insert my humble opinions into topics when I have so little experience.  I guess I was somewhat spoiled since when I posted on some issues outside of my build log, e.g.

Edge of Deck Plank Layout: Spirketting, Waterway, Margin Plank

 

I got responses fairly quickly.  And in fact, after I updated my build log, I saw another LN build log.  The last post in there, by Shickluna Searcher was reaching out for help and I posted the following:

Posted October 10

Searcher,

 

I'm in the same (no pun intended) boat, the Lady Nelson.  And I had the same issues you had with the first planking.  I was pointed to the definitive site videos  here: https://modelshipworld.com/forum/98-planking-downloads-and-tutorials-and-videos/ .  The key one is the 3rd I think, where Chuck shows how to edge-bend the planks.  It puts a curve into the plank that when bent in the normal sense, it lays right on top of the forward bulkheads.  Yeah, I also followed Leon, but after 5 x planks, I reached for help from the wizards around here.  They convinced me to start over, which I did.  I left the 1st plank on and edge-bent the rest of them.  And we will likely need to do the same for the 2nd planking.

 

I would also recommend that you go through Chuck's build of the Cheerful, which is close to the LN.  You can find that here: https://syrenshipmodelcompany.com/revenue-cutter-cheerful-1806.php.  There is a PDF for each chapter.

 

I'm just a little bit ahead of you in the build and you can check out my log.  I would recommend that you create your own log so you can post your own questions and not be lumped in with whadozer's log.

 

Good luck...John

 

(Still haven't figured out how to copy between topics.)

 

3 hours ago, glbarlow said:

Have a look at my Nelson log.

Believe me Glenn, your log is the go-to log for me when I hit a snag.

 

3 hours ago, JpR62 said:

I spent and still spend many hours going through the logs to find different solutions and tips. It is never wasted time and is well worth it.

I probably spend several hours everyday scouring different areas of this forum and others and usually I see things that click.

 

Again, thank you all for the advice.  I'm trying to be a good community person; will just try to be better.  And now to review the comments I got on my last log post.  Thanks Glenn.

 

John

[glbarlow]

18 minutes ago, drjeckl said:

somewhat intimidating to insert my humble opinions into topics

All of us started with little experience, as others said sometimes “nice work” is enough. We all hope someone’s reading our logs. A simple comment let’s us know there is. 

[Jack12477]

A simple "hi I am following your build" plus clicking the FOLLOW button at the top of the log, is all that's needed also. 

[drjeckl]

Thanks Jack; did not know about the Follow button, will make use of that.

 

John

[Matt D]

1 hour ago, drjeckl said:

I get it, although it is somewhat intimidating to insert my humble opinions into topics when I have so little experience.

I hear you.  But it’s easy to say something looks really good, even when you don’t know much about how it was done.  I’m still pretty new myself, with a lot to learn.  My biggest problem with this website is that it makes me want to build about a hundred more ship models.

[Old Collingwood]

57 minutes ago, drjeckl said:

Thanks Jack; did not know about the Follow button, will make use of that.

 

John

Also  an easy  way to  show interest  just by a way of saying  "Hi"  without using words  - is to  look down the current  activity  down the Right hand side list  and click on any subjects  that you like / have some interest in / or subject you know about, even if you dont leave a comment  you can just click  "the like button".

Our site is without doubt the lovliest  most friendly  site I have ever used in all my life.

 

Just keep chatting/liking  as like the Kevin Costner film  "Bulid it  - they will come  -   Chat and  you will make friends  / find answers to your questions"

 

Hope that helps?

 

And by the way  - a belated  Welcome to the family

 

OC.

[garyshipwright]

4 hours ago, drjeckl said:

All,

I really appreciate the advice. 

 I get it, although it is somewhat intimidating to insert my humble opinions into topics when I have so little experience.  I guess I was somewhat spoiled since when I posted on some issues outside of my build log, e.g.

 

 

John please don't feel Intimidated, we all started out very much like your self, and probably felt the same when I would ask those very same question on some ones build that to me had been doing this for a very long time. Others here have already answered some of your points but if you have any question hope over to my log and will be happy to help any way I can, not only your self but other's. Gary

[mtaylor]

John,

There's more resources here than build logs.   If you need help and have specific questions, have a look in this area:  https://modelshipworld.com/forum/12-shop-notes-ship-modeling-tips-techniques-and-research/

 

Each category has tons of Q@A and often a quick search using the search feature and the settings within will get an answer.  It may not be specific to your model but the answers may help.

 

There's also this area which is for general (not a specific model) that can provide answers:  https://modelshipworld.com/forum/58-general-ship-model-kit-discussions-not-build-logs/

[drjeckl]

48 minutes ago, Matt D said:

My biggest problem with this website is that it makes me want to build about a hundred more ship models.

Same here, Matt.  I'm not far on the Lady Nelson and I have already bought and received Vanguard Model's Speedy, figuring it would be out-of-stock during the pandemic.  Should not have bet against Chris Watton.😁

 

34 minutes ago, Old Collingwood said:

Also  an easy  way to  show interest  just by a way of saying  "Hi"  without using words  - is to  look down the current  activity  down the Right hand side list  and click on any subjects  that you like / have some interest in / or subject you know about, even if you dont leave a comment  you can just click  "the like button".

Thanks OC.  Another good tip.  Just liked your post.

 

35 minutes ago, garyshipwright said:

but if you have any question hope over to my log and will be happy to help any way I can, not only your self but other's. Gary

Very generous offer, Gary.  Thank you.

 

13 minutes ago, mtaylor said:

There's more resources here than build logs.

Thanks Mark.  I've already posted into the tips & techniques area.  Was curious about whether to post a question there or in my build log.  Can you advise on what the protocol is?  Or point me to where that is discussed?

 

Did not know about the ship model kit discussions.  Looks like another useful resource.

[MEDDO]

13 minutes ago, drjeckl said:

I've already posted into the tips & techniques area.  Was curious about whether to post a question there or in my build log.  Can you advise on what the protocol is?

There is no real official protocol and we just put it where we think it will fit nicely.  Most of the time if the question is very specific to a problem you are having in your build then the build log would be a good place (my gunport template won't line up with my frames any ideas?).  If it is a more general topic then the specific sub forum would be nice as an independent topic (want to start using an airbrush to paint where to start?).  

 

Sometimes question in a build log become so interesting and consuming with so many posts the mods will split it off into its own sub forum as a new independent topic.

[BobG]

Hello John, others have given you a lot of good advice about your concerns and it's easy to see just how helpful the forum members are here on MSW. I read the forum for several years before I finally took the plunge and actually began participating and, even then, it took some coaxing from others before I finally opened a build log on my Medway Longboat half way through the build.

 

 It was a great experience to not only share what I was doing, mistakes and all, but also to get lots of positive feedback which kept me motivated. I had never done any rigging before and I was hesitant to start it since it seemed so complicated. I received a lot of good advice and encouragement and it ended up being my favorite part of the build.

 

Of course, most of the interactions I had at that time were with other Medway Longboat builders but I also posted questions about rigging and various techniques etc in other forum areas specific to certain topics. I got lots of good advice that way also. I'm always appreciative of the advice and complements I get and I enjoy letting others know how appreciative I am. Like Chuck has mentioned, it's a back and forth thing and, before you know it, you've made friends while learning a lot and being complimentary in the process.

 

My problem now is that I seem to spend more time reading and posting than I do working on my current build! 

 

Good luck on your build and remember to take it slow and enjoy the journey...

[mtaylor]

37 minutes ago, drjeckl said:

Thanks Mark.  I've already posted into the tips & techniques area.  Was curious about whether to post a question there or in my build log.  Can you advise on what the protocol is?  Or point me to where that is discussed?

Michael gave some good advice.

 

As far as posting questions, post them where you think best.  If it's in the wrong place (say a question on rigging guns is in the rigging area) usually one of us moderators will see it and move it to the right place.   

 

Also, anytime you have questions and are hesitant about asking where to look or post, PM a moderator.  We're here to help.

[drjeckl]

Michael, that's what I figured.  I've posted in the tips forum with:

I got good, quick answers to all but the "Are deck cutouts necessary?"; got none there but that may have been due to my short reply.  Nobody advised that these should have been from my build log so I guess I have the feel for this.

 

Thanks for your help...John

[MEDDO]

One more thing for the newer members I have said before.  This is a world wide forum with people of all skill levels.  We literally have some of the best modelers in the world post regularly here.  People who literally wrote the books on our subjects.  Sort of a basketball forum with Lebron posting daily or a swimming forum where Phelps is all over the place.  Sometimes this is pretty intimidating.  Us mere mortals must always remember everyone starts somewhere and we all want to improve.  Some of those "pros" are the nicest and most helpful people here.  The tone and encouragement from everyone here on the forum makes this the best place to be

[drjeckl]

 

4 minutes ago, MEDDO said:

The tone and encouragement from everyone here on the forum makes this the best place to be

 

Michael and to everyone who's posted here:

 

Yes, indeed.  I have been so impressed with the responses to my ask; I don't know what to say.  The compassion (especially by Chuck) shown to a new guy like me is a testament to your efforts to make this a world class source for this hobby, notwithstanding the aims of the NRG.  And it was worth it: I have gained a new understanding of why and how this site works.  And it may be required reading by all new guys (and girls)!  Just a thought.

 

Thank you again for your comments...John😂

[Old Collingwood]

27 minutes ago, MEDDO said:

One more thing for the newer members I have said before.  This is a world wide forum with people of all skill levels.  We literally have some of the best modelers in the world post regularly here.  People who literally wrote the books on our subjects.  Sort of a basketball forum with Lebron posting daily or a swimming forum where Phelps is all over the place.  Sometimes this is pretty intimidating.  Us mere mortals must always remember everyone starts somewhere and we all want to improve.  Some of those "pros" are the nicest and most helpful people here.  The tone and encouragement from everyone here on the forum makes this the best place to be

So well said Michael.👍

 

OC.

[drjeckl]

10 hours ago, Chuck said:

This is something we have been trying to improve but you must understand that with so many build logs.

Just read your "Take the "2 build log challenge"!!!. Any Takers"  Seems like I'm a poster child for that promotion.  Keep it up!

[ERS Rich]

Always open to answering a question....

 

Happy New Year!
 

-Rich